No Matter How I Look at It, It's You Guys' Fault I'm Not Popular!
| techinaccly almost all the girls in MALare like that :3 |
| I had a classmate like her in my junior year. lol. |
| The only reason why more people aren't aware that people like Tomoko exist is because they haven't met one themselves. I know one, and I'm probably one of the persons who made him the way he is. Our class did not talk about ignoring him but he started pissing off people one by one in our class for different reasons until no one wanted to talk to him. |
CEMPUNK said: techinaccly almost all the girls in MALare like that :3 techinaccly ur stupid. |
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Leapling said: CEMPUNK said: techinaccly almost all the girls in MALare like that :3 techinaccly ur stupid. Someone feels offended Puke you have my back <3 |
הלב שלי כבר מת |
Houndthree said: Leapling said: CEMPUNK said: techinaccly almost all the girls in MALare like that :3 techinaccly ur stupid. Someone feels offended Puke you have my back <3 Fuck you Hound. |
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| I have some similarities to her but not so much an extreme and I have various friends who have a few things she does just as strongly. Not sure I've ever personally known someone who has the full combo of everything yet then again a lot of what goes on Tomokos head is in her head not spoken out loud so maybe I did know someone like this but I never talked to them to find out. This might be why some people would be unaware of this. These kinds of people tend to be shyer and you cant read minds. Everyone I know who has similarities to Tomoko became that way from emotional scars and trauma. I also only know of these people online because you dont always get to talk about this sort of thing to someone in person really unless you are super close. TallonKarrde23 said: The only disorder is her social anxiety that came about FROM this stuff she does. What she's done up to that and still continues is not purely social anxiety. She blames people for things even when she's 100% alone doing something 100% related to just her. I don't know why you think its that way rather than the other. Usually someone develops anxiety from worrying about the future and that is usually caused by some past external factor. Sure her cognitive distortions cause her to stay away from people even more but its a result of her lack of a social life not the original cause. She shows no signs of having schizoid personality disorder (one who is a total lone wolf and has no interest in relationships with others) as far as ive seen considering she actually tries to make friends or talk to others rather than shrug them off entirely. She is trying to make herself feel better by holding others to high standards that she tries to put on herself and obviously most people wont meet those ideals. It doesnt make sense entirely when you try to make sense of it but this sort of thing never makes sense. I know people who do similar things sometimes and I do this to some degree myself too. Shes not really a bitch or anything but she is so caught up in her problems it blinds her sometimes to the point she overreacts and blows up her problems even worse. Hoppy said: Tomoko is exaggerated to the max, while Hikikomori exist in real life, they are far from the extraordinarily timid, gloomy, and depressing that Tomoko is and those traits together clash and thus are unrealistic. Shes not a hikikomori because she is too young and goes to school and clearly has some other kind of anxiety disorder but still makes some attempt to interact with people even though a very failed attempt often which excludes her being a hikki. Being a hikikomori is more related to being overwhelmed with the pressures of society thus withdrawing from it entirely. Tomoko just is way out of practice and scared. If she was still this way when shes older and no longer in school then she could be maybe. Of course the deffinition isnt that clear either. http://www.mindthesciencegap.org/2012/11/16/can-culture-create-mental-disease-the-rise-of-hikikomori-in-the-wake-of-economic-downturn-in-japan/ "The word “hikikomori,” literally meaning “pulling in” or “withdrawal,” was first introduced in 1998 by Japanese psychiatrist, Tamaki Saito in his book “Social Withdrawal: A Neverending Adolescence.”1 In this book, Saito defined hikikomori as “those who withdraw entirely from society and stay in their own homes for more than six months, with onset by the latter half of their twenties, and for whom other psychiatric disorders do not better explain the primary causes of this condition.” " "In May 2010, the Japanese government funded a research group that attempted to succinctly classify and create guidelines for the assessment and treatment of the disorder. The group’s finalized definition, however, retains much of the confusion that facilitated the need for the investigation itself, leaving the disorder in a limbo without a true etiological context. The group defined hikikomori as follows: “A phenomenon in which persons become recluses in their own homes, avoiding various social situations (e.g. attending school, working, having social interactions outside of the home etc.) for at least six months. They may go out without any social contact with others. In principle, hikikomori is considered a non-psychotic condition distinguished from social withdrawal due to positive or negative symptoms of schizophrenia. However, there is a possibility of underlying prodromal schizophrenia.” " |
| I can say positively that I was almost like Tomoko in my adolescence. But then I went to university and everything changed lol. |
ワンダーランド花 ♥ |
| I just think Tomoko is hilarious, she's easy to laugh at and makes me feel better about myself for being able to socialize like a regular human being. I'm sure there's alot of people in real life like her and I frankly don't care, they serve the same purpose to me as Tomoko does, a quick and easy laugh. |
| I'm sure there are plenty, it's one of my solaces for why I suck, then seeing them makes me see- wow people suck more than me as nhk tells you to do |
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zoze said: porkypink said: There are people like this Alot of people are like this. Including me As exaggerated as it seems, All the hilarious scenes, despairful moments Tomoko experiences are so realistic. Episode 1: Whenever I see kids from my school outside of school, if Im by myself, I try to avoid them from seeing me. Episode 2: When school trips come close I also get worried about every single thing Tomoko mentioned in her head. Episode 3: The most despairful moment is when the teachers have students make their own groups. I always wanted to kill myself when they do that. haha I don't mind being by myself in a place alone. Though I hate being by myself in a place with alot of groups of people. this, +the yandere abuse cd This is kind of me at the moment. Except now, I force myself to talk to other people little by little. At least it's better than how I was a few years ago, skipping lunch and going to the library instead of eating by myself, stuff like that. I still have more 'friends' online than I do in real life, but I'm okay with that. ^^ Also I really want to find that yandere CD haha. |
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| I am a social retard nearly on par with Tomoko. |
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| As others have noted, people do realize these people exist. Most aren't as extreme as Tomoko, though. Although I rarely had such problems in school, I've definitely felt the same kind of anxiety as Tomoko in any situation where I didn't know anyone. And while I'm still introverted, a lot of the social anxiety I once had has gone away by now. So there is hope for her. |
| I haven't even seen this anime and I can already relate to the MC. Except the part of never having a boyfriend. People do realize they exist they just don't want to bother with them. I speak from experience. |
| I have social anxiety disorder and I can safely say that Tomoko's behaviours are not exaggerated. The only difference is they can show her thoughts outside of her head, with art, you know? She is a severe case, but worse people do exist. I wouldn't say I was worse than her but I can't even be around strangers without being anxious, nevermind talk to them, so I'm a complete shut-in right now. I do however strive for friendship and try to make smalltalk in class. Nonetheless I find her hillarious. It's good to have a laugh and poke fun at your problems, crying over them wont get you anywhere. (And, as others have mentioned, will make it harder for people to deal with you.) |
EccentricsJul 23, 2013 6:51 PM
| It's annoying that some people keep saying that it's exaggerated in this anime, because definitely is not. Everything from her barely being able to say goodbye to the teacher, to immediately dreading the school trip which is way off in the future, is 100% realistic. |
| Shoot first, think never. |
Open-Dice said: It's annoying that some people keep saying that it's exaggerated in this anime, because definitely is not. Everything from her barely being able to say goodbye to the teacher, to immediately dreading the school trip which is way off in the future, is 100% realistic. I love you! |
| It definitely is realistic. But, I personally just don't like Tomoko very much. If she didn't hate everybody and actually put some effort into changing herself, then she could become what she wants to be. I really wish this show would give her some character development, but seeing as it is just a gag manga, it doesn't look like it. It's just funny, there isn't much depth. I mean, that's okay, but it gets depressing to watch sometimes, you know? I feel like many people use the words "social anxiety" to write off their inability to make friends. If you just put some effort and put yourself out there, it's really not that hard. Of course, at times it definitely is a psychological problem, but even then, with willpower, anything in the mind can be overcome. Also, I think it's silly when people say things like, "I just don't like being around people." That's stupid. We all enjoy being around others. I consider myself an introverted person, but I enjoy being with other people. Maybe I enjoy being alone more than an outgoing person, but still we all have an affinity towards others. |
| I have had some experiences like her myself in the past but I can't really feel bad for her most of the time (only did when her brother's friends called her ugly) because she's not really a great person herself.I mean she's really judgmental and it really annoyed me in these 3 episodes.wishing death on people (for stupid reasons too),calling others sluts,fatasses,etc (is she in any position to judge others herself?) In her case it's not that people don't like her because she's different or anything like that,most of her problems come from the fact that she has a shitty personality,I can't really sympathize with her. |
SalxerJul 23, 2013 9:49 PM
fishergirl16 said: Also, I think it's silly when people say things like, "I just don't like being around people." That's stupid. We all enjoy being around others. I consider myself an introverted person, but I enjoy being with other people. Maybe I enjoy being alone more than an outgoing person, but still we all have an affinity towards others. No, that's just YOU being stupid. |
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| I laugh at her and this show a shit ton. AHAHA So hilarious. But still why does Tomoko want to be popular? Popularity just spawns you haters. Just remain a shut in. No love, no hate. Fair exchange. |
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| lolwat This is uncomfortably hilarious. This was pretty much my first year of high school...except I didn't pay attention to anyone at all, so I just assumed everyone else - whose existence I was vaguely aware of - was like me. Or something along those lines. but yeah...I've known a lot of people like this. I still get times where I just can't leave my house, and if I do I just walk around staring at people like a crazy person. I think it's something we all need to do every now and then XD EDIT, regarding relevant psychology and mindset: I'm reading a lot of comments about Tomoko being a shit person. I wouldn't word it like that, but I don't disagree either. People with shitty attitudes don't realize they have shitty attitudes. I used to think very similarly to her, silently blaming other people for why I felt bad. It's all habits, and to tell the truth it's not always a conscious choice (please take note of the word CONSCIOUS there). I started getting bullied hardcore REALLY early on in my life, so after a few years of that I just constantly assumed other people were shit, and took every nice comment as hostility (because there was a time when that was almost true). To say that one puts themself in that situation is to say that they thought it up and worked toward it with intention. That's just not true. Shitty people don't realize they're (we're) being shitty until we take a step back from it and see the whole picture, and I think that's something we're going to see later on. At least we better, or else this is going to be a shit show. Oh and one more thing, for anyone who's interested in this shit, a lot of people subconsciously or otherwise internalize judgments that have been made on them in the past, and in the early stages of coming to terms with said shit will see those aspects in other people. There's a bunch of shit about this called psychological projection, sometimes also called Freudian projection because people have a hardon for his shit almost as hard as he did. |
GrmoJul 23, 2013 11:14 PM
| I'm not sure why people think she's a bad person when her brother, Tomoki, has shown worse traits IMO because he seems to be so embarrassed by her he has no problem throwing her under the bus so to speak . |
traed said: I'm not sure why people think she's a bad person when her brother, Tomoki, has shown worse traits IMO because he seems to be so embarrassed by her he has no problem throwing her under the bus so to speak . Eh he's actually pretty nice to her. I wouldn't even know how to get along with someone like Tomoki. |
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Leapling said: He does act nice to her but his attitude is similar to hers in that he cares more about his own popularity than he does her. Its out of pity for her or at least that's how it comes off. He is more stable mentally but still pretty cold in mannerisms. Basically they are both similar but also opposites. Technically they are pretty equal its just I personally dislike his way of being more even though Tomoko might not be always that pleasant to be near.Eh he's actually pretty nice to her. I wouldn't even know how to get along with someone like Tomoki. |
traedJul 24, 2013 12:28 AM
| Pretty sure that there are tons of people like this who have this sort of behaviour and i used to be one of them. I was such a introverted person back then i didn't like socializing with people knowing i will be excluded and i just didn't know how to talk to people. I still found this show to be really funny and extreme though i feel a little guilty about it =x |
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Estherella said: Introverted doesnt really mean non sociable. Introverted means you need alone time to recharge yourself so you might be alone more often than around others but Ive known very introverted people who are very sociable to go out often and be in groups of friends even. Same goes for extroverts. They arent always loud mouthed talkative people they can just be people who feel off when alone.Pretty sure that there are tons of people like this who have this sort of behaviour and i used to be one of them. I was such a introverted person back then i didn't like socializing with people knowing i will be excluded and i just didn't know how to talk to people. I still found this show to be really funny and extreme though i feel a little guilty about it =x |
traed said: Estherella said: Introverted doesnt really mean non sociable. Introverted means you need alone time to recharge yourself so you might be alone more often than around others but Ive known very introverted people who are very sociable to go out often and be in groups of friends even. Same goes for extroverts. They arent always loud mouthed talkative people they can just be people who feel off when alone.Pretty sure that there are tons of people like this who have this sort of behaviour and i used to be one of them. I was such a introverted person back then i didn't like socializing with people knowing i will be excluded and i just didn't know how to talk to people. I still found this show to be really funny and extreme though i feel a little guilty about it =x I was both but then it happened as a result of bullying...so I wasn't just introverted, i didn't know how to talk to people. Every time i wanted to say hello, it seems like it's a big step for me and i always missed the chance. Except i wasn't as cynical as Tomoki was. |
EstherellaJul 24, 2013 12:43 AM
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gaimcap said: The thing is... maybe they do... but like someone else mentioned, it's a pain in the ass to deal with people like that... I always had (and to a degree, still have) a case of social anxiety(avoidance... I would always flinch at having to do anything, for fear of having to deal with others. The stuff in the show almost wasn't an exaggeration for me) and cynicism so I completely understand how that level of loneliness and solitude can warp your mind. But, I was always at least kind, polite, and respectful (because I felt every individual--as fellow humans--were deserving of that. And my social issues were mine and mine alone. Not anyone else.) so I eventually made friends. And by now, I've now forced myself to talk to enough individuals, that I'm actually considered a pretty friendly and talkative guy (A fact which is still completely bizarre to me). On the flip-side. I've known at least two people who had an attacking mindset. And, knowing their position, I tried to reach out to them.. but, in both cases they made you feel like all they cared for was themselves, and that in their eyes, friendship wasn't about being a mutual friendly, but more about what they could get from the friendship. As if people weren't people to them, but interactive objects to provide the attention they craved... And talking to other people, I was not alone in wanting to help them, but I also wasn't alone in feeling I didn't really exist as a person to them, and that at some point they'd burn you... So why would you ever knowingly put yourself in that situation? I kind of feel for the main character... but at the same time the stuff that goes on in her head is so mean spirited, that I completely lose all sympathy. In my experience, that's how it works in real life too. Positive change comes from you, and your willingness to find it, no one can ever externally force it on you. You've hit the nail there. Right on the head. Well, close. There's a point however, where those two personality types you mention, blend to an extent you can't tell them much apart. Me myself, can be such a case. And I hate myself for it. You know you're causing pain when people try to help. Like, I do want friends, and I do try my best to treat all those around me with respect, however, when I certain point comes, I care about myself, and that person's support, more than anything else. I do feel selfish, and it is quite the flaw; I realize this. But the main point, is that these things blur. It can start as one thing, and turn to another. Always, people will say I'm nice and genuine, and once I'm close enough, I become something ugly. For the most part. You said it yourself, the feeling spiral out of control. The causes are just deep in there. None of it is intentional, sadly. |
| Bullying is bull :C |
traed said: Bullying is bull :C It was horrible time...I hate it I can't believe i cried at that times too... What worse is i had friends who actually knew i was like this but still make use of me. Fking betrayal. At that time, i couldn't talk to people properly and they were saying shit that i dun even understand and it gradually got worse. I became more timid then i build my own comfort zone and felt more comfortable being alone. And having insults throw in your face all the time doesn't really help my self-esteem either. |
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| I facepalm at everyone saying Tomoko is just a bitch with a bad personality and that's why she doesn't have any friends. None of you know what you're talking about. Think about if you weren't hearing any of her thoughts. She would just look like a normal quiet girl who isn't good at talking to others. That's the thing: anything about her that makes you call her a bad person is all in her head. How many times did she verbalize any of the mean thoughts going through her head? Has she ever pissed anyone off (brother aside)? I bet none of you realize how judgmental every person in the world is every single day. It's just a little different when you're being given someone else's perspective, because now it's not yourself you're criticizing. I mean, you've all proven my point already. You're judging her as a bad person for what goes on in her head. Think about it. Think about when you're standing in line at a store and you can hear the person at the front arguing with the clerk. Think about when the light turns green and the car in front of you doesn't move, or when someone cuts you off. Even among friends or in class, think about when someone says they like something you think is terrible, like Justin Bieber or Sword Art Online. Also, she's a high schooler. High schooler's are like this more than most. Yes, I have been very judgmental in this post. |
Redfoxoffire said: I facepalm at everyone saying Tomoko is just a bitch with a bad personality and that's why she doesn't have any friends. None of you know what you're talking about. this. |
Redfoxoffire said: I facepalm at everyone saying Tomoko is just a bitch with a bad personality and that's why she doesn't have any friends. None of you know what you're talking about. This is right. I see it as her just trying to cope with the crappy situation she is in, being unable to speak to people and being ignored by everyone. People don't realize how frustrating it would be. Someone earlier in the thread said she should just make an effort to change, but did you see how much she struggled just to say goodbye, a single word, to the teacher? It's not something you could just "choose" to do, it's a real psychological barrier. |
| Shoot first, think never. |
| I know people like this exist. It's a funny way to show it but it hides a common truth. I sometimes felt like her but in the way of friends and to have a partner. I had a girlfriend but after that I really hate to have a relationship. I prefer to be myself and I. Because sometimes things in this world are not ready for you or you just don't want to face it. |
| Oh well, I can relate myself to her. Everything. The only difference is that I'm not aiming to become popular. |
Onibokusu said: Open-Dice said: YorozuyaGinSan said: Onibokusu said: Watamote is to anime as The Big Bang Theory is to sitcoms. Couldn't agree more. What do you mean by that? I've only seen 2 or 3 episodes of The Big Bang Theory but it looks to me like a normal sitcom, only with geek jokes thrown in every now and then. It's a show pulled along by fans who think they're just like the main character(s) because they can relate to, or 'understand,' a few simple concepts presented despite not ever actually experiencing anything close to what's trying to be portrayed. To quell non-understanding, people laugh at shallow references designed specifically for them. That's why it's a 'comedy' and not a drama, despite the subject matter. In the end, the producer(s) lost the original audience, replaced with psuedo-understanding idiots that think social anxiety is hilarious - they are then pandered to. +1. Hate BBT. |
Leapling said: fishergirl16 said: Also, I think it's silly when people say things like, "I just don't like being around people." That's stupid. We all enjoy being around others. I consider myself an introverted person, but I enjoy being with other people. Maybe I enjoy being alone more than an outgoing person, but still we all have an affinity towards others. No, that's just YOU being stupid. If it's stupid, then why would those so-called people who dislike being with others enjoy watching anime that glorifies relationships between people? Not just shoujo manga/anime, all genres of anime almost always focus on relationships between people. If someone really hated being around people, then why would they watch shows like these? Saying things like "I don't like being with other people." are just excuses. Open-Dice said: Someone earlier in the thread said she should just make an effort to change, but did you see how much she struggled just to say goodbye, a single word, to the teacher? It's not something you could just "choose" to do, it's a real psychological barrier. The answer is obvious. It is something you choose to do. Tomoko just needs to keep talking to people in order to break the 'barrier' down. But that's probably not going to happen much in the anime because it's a gag manga. |
fishergirl16Jul 25, 2013 10:59 AM
| Tu quoque.... |
HorrorLandJul 25, 2013 11:31 PM
| I am hesitant to question BlackCrescent's sincerity. For one thing, this is an anime discussion thread, so statements about people here are not appropriate. You can use the word "ad-hominem" for that. On the other hand, tradition has always been that it is acceptable for any of us to make statements about ourselves. Apart from that, I can never think of any instance where it became apparent that somebody was pretending to be something that they were not. We are anonymous, so there is no motivation to lie. The easiest thing is just to be honest. So let's cut BlackCrescent some slack and just listen to what he said about himself. If anybody has comments, address them to the topic of this thread. |
| Cognitive Dissonance look it up! |
| Dr. Sheldon Cooper " It is no way to make new humans. People coming out of people. Some kind of dirty magic show. |
| I do realize it cause cause this is how my younger cousin is. She is always coming to me for advice since she looks at me like an older brother and because i'm "successful" because i have like 2 good friends and getting married next year.... I'm sorry cousin-chan.. Your older cousin is just a pitiful sometimes T_T |
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