cipheron said: Macross F, great series. What's the usual way you do these watches? Though I've already seen it and know it very well - i was living in a place we didn't have internet and a friend copied it for me on disc, so i watched the whole series 3 times. So I'd have to be careful with any comments so i don't spoil anything. Be great to have another person along for the group watch. We watched the original Macross 1982 a few months back in a group watch and enjoyed it so much we pencilled in Macross F for a future watch, which we've now arrived at. One episode per day and post when you can, as real life can sometimes make daily posts difficult. |
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cipheron said: 23feanor said: Be great to have another person along for the group watch. We watched the original Macross 1982 a few months back in a group watch and enjoyed it so much we pencilled in Macross F for a future watch, which we've now arrived at. One episode per day and post when you can, as real life can sometimes make daily posts difficult. IDK if you're up to it, but I highly recommend Macross Zero OVA (which is 5 episodes) before Macross Frontier, there are several plot threads that connect both series. Funny you mention Macross Zero, I finished it a few days ago, I meant to watch Macross Do You remember Love movie as well to reorient myself but didn't get around to it. I liked the visuals in Macross Zero of the tropical island but the story was lukewarm until the final couple of episodes. |
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| Episode 1. First impression, the visuals are a huge step up from the original Macross, which had its own charm but the look of the Frontier fleet and its city are on another level. So Sheryl is our Minmay type, I do hope she's not as wishy washy as Minmay (I loved her singing [couldn't get 'My Boyfriend is a Pilot' out of my head for ages] but she was so high maintenance and didn't know her own mind half the time, some might say Minmay was mercurial but that would be generous imho, great character though, if I have strong feelings about a character either way they did their job). Personally Misa was much more my cup of tea. Ok that was a pretty kick ass first episode. So Sheryl comes off a bitch at first, but is there more to her than an entitled idol? Then we meet Princess Alto and sweet Ranka, who I'm guessing is half or part Zentradi from her hair colour (like Millia from Macross). The action looked great, I couldn't tell what was cgi and what was 2D at times. So a new unknown enemy has appeared, one that seems to have superior military capabilities. Looking forward to ep 2 tomorrow. |
23feanorMay 19, 2022 8:35 AM
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| @cipheron quick question, what does deculture and yack-deculture mean? I tried looking them up on google but didn't really get a decent answer? I heard them saying deculture a number of times during the episode. I remember that human 'culture' was the factor that overthrew the Zentradi in the original Macross. I've seen Macross 1982, Macross Plus and Macross Zero but haven't seen Macross 7, so wondered if it's a term from this show. I noticed a couple of the easter eggs (like the Macross ship shaped school) but not the others, thanks for pointing out. Lots of history already in this franchise. |
23feanorMay 19, 2022 8:49 AM
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cipheron said: @23feanor https://macross.fandom.com/wiki/Deculture Deculture (デカルチャー de-karucha-) is a Zentradi / Meltrandi expression of shock and surprise. It was first used in The Super Dimension Fortress Macross: Do You Remember Love?, then later in Macross 7, Macross Frontier, as well as Macross Δ ... After Space War I, humans and Zentradi started to coexist with one another on Earth. ... As a result, the word "Deculture" was also adopted into human language. The current usage however is a far cry from before. It now describes something "amazing" or "great". (Also, Sheryl's catch phrase "listen to my song" is also Basara's catch phrase from Macross 7) BTW watching the deculture version of episode 1 now. There are enough differences that it feels like it was worth watching, even though i just finished the normal version. It runs 3 minutes longer, however they cut plenty of stuff out too, so there's definitely more than 3 minutes of extra footage. But you do end up missing some of the things they cut, and this seems like it would be rectified in the Yack Deculture version - which runs over 32 minutes long. I'm going to save that for tomorrow however and watch the full extended ep 1 and ep 2 together. Watching it 3 times in a day is a bit much. THat's helpful thanks. The version of Ep 1 I saw ran 32.04 but looks like ep 2 only runs 24 mins. Maybe I'll catch up on the DYRL movie in the next few days. |
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| Episode 2. That opening sequence is one of the coolest mecha fights I've seen. Having it in the streets of the frontier city made it even more stunning. Decent OST as well for the fighting and aftermath scenes. So Alto and Ranka meet again after he saves her from the new enemy the Varja (haven't heard of them before). We and Alto are introduced to the SMS, a private mech company. Ranka, Sheryl and Alto all meet up just as the attack begins. Ranka has a lovely voice and there seems to be something about her the Varja respond or are attracted to. Another solid episode. |
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| Episode 1 The characters for sure feel like a "best of" mash-up of the Macross shows I've seen (1982, Zero and Plus) and the animation quality is just wow. Some of the highest action sequence quality I've seen in TV anime and even OVA. With @cipheron our humble group attracted a serious franchise fan and expert, welcome, and I'm really looking forward to your comments and vast knowledge. A stroke of luck to have you on board. Episode 1 introduces the three main characters. Sheryl "Galactic Fairy" Nome, a top selling idol coming to the frontier city spaceship as part of her galactic tour. She's a pro trough and trough, tightly controling her media personality and image, but not a bad person. Ranka Lee is the underdog girl with a touch of Cinderella, a natural kawaii and kindness, but she's always a bit off the track - "wrong planet" syndrome. Just like Minmay she works in a Chinese restaurant, and in her spare time sings. And finally the male MC is an outspoken bishounen with long blue hair, Alto Saotome. He's a highly gifted hobby pilot and has even some show talent, coming from a performing arts family background. So yea, the mandatory love triangle is set :) During Sheryl's concert the Frontier fleet is attacked by a hitherto unknown alien species. The combined land, space and air fights are very similar to the first few episodes of the original Macross, but with breathtaking CG animation. The fleet is defended by a private military contractor, the SMS. Overall, the setting varies the proven base ingredients and setting: a (likely) love triangle around an (likely) ace pilot, an alien threat, and the idol showbiz. Just what the doctor prescribed, and delivered in top quality. Episode 2 More world building and introduction of some military side characters. It turn out Ranka's older brother, Ozma Lee, is the ace pilot and leader of the "Skull Platoon" aligned to the larger military contractor SMS. His unit saved the day fróm the aliens in episode 1, and for some reason he wants to hide his job from Ranka. He's the cool badass type, unshaven and driving a vintage car. Using a somewhat more shady military organization than the squeaky clean military of Captain Global will allow for interesting plot variations. Story wise, Ranka serves as damsel in distress so Alto can rescue her. He uses a military fighter (Macross' trademark jet-mecha mix) orphaned after the original pilot is killed in action. After the successful fight, he's approached by Ozma who seems to be interested in recruiting this talent. He also wants to learn from eye witness Alto how his comrade died. Rescued damsel Ranka tries to get a date, but Alto is very cool and reluctant. Overall, the youngster ace pilot of the show flies his first mission, and 50% of the love triangle are seeded. The show doesn't waste time in setup. |
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| I'm coming into this series entirely blind, but I like what I've seen so far. Episode 1 really just covered basic intros to these characters and the world around them. Three main characters, likely love triangle involved here, and a space-faring people dealing with giant alien mechs. What's not to love? The general animation of the series is fine, but the animation of the mechs and other flying vehicles in fights is a cut above the rest. Some of the dogfights in this episode are absolutely mesmerizing, and it really sets the pace for the rest of the series. Episode 2 does more to explain the military structure, where Ranka's older brother fits into it, and gives some notion of why they're fighting with special vehicles that transform into armors (basically mechas). The main important factor introduced in this episode is Ranka's apparent effect on the alien creatures, though it's unclear what elicits a response from them beyond her being loud and/or singing. More will come of that to be sure. Our three characters end up together right at the end as another of these creatures come after them. Good start. Looking forward to more. |
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| Episode 3 Prepares multiple future story developments. First, Ranka (Miss Macross participation) and Alto (joins SMS as a contractor pilot) are put on their respective career paths as idol and ace pilot. Second, Ranka, Sheryl and Alto "accidentally" meet and are forced into an emergency shelter together by a Vajra attack. Down there they have time for some bonding, bickering, character development and boob jokes. Third, Ozma is wounded and in hospital reveals Ranka's and his backstory. He isn't her real Onii-chan, and blames himself for the death of her parents in a Vajira attack a decade ago. Which made him the slightly bitter mercenary he is, and causing amnesia in her to cope with trauma. I really hate the amnesia trope in writing, lazy AF and as usual I hope it's not played too prominently. Ranka is 25% Zentradi and her dog-ear style moveable hair is one of those weird wtf-Japan designs. She has a traumatic past to break trough at some point, and is so innocent and cute even Sheryl falls for her babe charm. A nice bitter-sweet character layout. Alto-hime's feminine bishi appearance is in contrast with the feeling he somehow got a raw deal in life and is always a little angry. Basically the larval version of Ozma, a borderline bitter and guilt ridden lone hero type. There's noting remarkable about Sheryl yet, but I'm sure she has a dark secret as well. Overall, probably the last of the exposition dump episodes. The show handled it all routinely and with good pacing. It helps that many of the story elements are Macross staples and thus need a little less introduction. Macross = love triangle + alien military threat + idol music + ace pilots. The character "defects" we get here are interesting twists compared to the fairly heroic and straight character writing of the 1980s. With a more gray cast (by space opera action show standards) there's more room for character driven drama, which I welcome. |
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| I just got stuck with this math thought. Ranka is 25% Zentradi, so one of ther grandparents was Zentradi. The events of Macross F take place 2059 and she's 16 years old, i.e. born 2043 (conceived 2042 even). The first contact between humans and Zentradi took place 2009, peace only in 2010. That leaves just a little more than 30 years for 2 generations of mixed heritage lineage. There probably aren't too many of Ranka's kind. |
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| Episode 4 Part two of the Ranka and Alto's training arcs as pilot and idol, in a parallel montage. Alto has his first kill of a Vajra. Ranka qualified for the Miss Macross Frontier pageant, where she looks and feels a lot like a wall flower among all those ambitious divas. And then Kyuun kyuun... happens, a moment we were all afraid of. With all due respect, Minmay wins - don't snow the snowman. Ranka doesn't win, but her clumsy cuteness and singing ability doesn't go unnoticed with the jury nevertheless. Alto is tortured by his drill inspector, Full Metal VF style. His final test is a fight in real space against an all-female Zentradi squad Pixies, which takes place in parallel to Ranka's Kyuun Kyuun. Suddenly a Vajra appears and the battle turns real. There's another fairly wtf-Japan moment. We see Pixie pilot Klang Klan in both her giant and micronized form. Big boobed Amazon in space, loli tsundere at the after party - pick the form of The Destructor, Venkman. The cliff hanger has Sheryl waiting for and approaching Alto after the party is over. Overall, I'm surprised how parallel they choose to develop the characters w/r to Macross (1982) motifs. There's a lot of fan servicehomage going on here, but it's well made. But it's about time to divert this into it's own story now. |
inimMay 22, 2022 2:33 AM
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| Episode 3. I wonder what that implant thing the lady with purple hair who works with Sheryl, had is and how it works, is it alien/zentradi tech? She asked if it was illegal on the Frontier, insinuating it's illegal in other parts of the fleet. Sheryl falling over and her dress falling down felt forced and silly, like a cheap harem/ecchi trope, including her tsundere reaction and slap. It's a very different sort of love triangle they're setting up here to Macross original. Sheryl is nothing like Minmay, and Misa is nothing like Ranka. Sheryl rubs me the wrong way, so I instantly feel like I'm in camp Ranka but that may change as we learn more about Sheryl. Is Sheryl French as I've seen her speak French a couple of times, or use small French phrases? We get Rank's back story. Alto joins the SMS and Ranka goes for Miss Macross. We also see Leon and Miss Catherine are together although she doesn't look very happy about it. Episode 4. Ranka makes the Miss Macross tournament and Alto trains with the SMS. So Miss Catherine was a runner up in previous contest. Alto's dad turns up to the contest and ignores his son. I wonder whether that's because he's so good looking, or played a female role in a play (was rakugo mentioned). Anyway there's clearly some issues between them and the reason for huge chip on Alto's shoulder. And then they play Kyun Kyun. I don't mind the song so much, just it's overuse in the original Macross. Ranka sings it quite nicely. So we have some actual zentradi on board who work for the SMS, just not sure why they make the captain a cute loli when she's shrunken down. |
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| Episode 3 This one really gives more of an opportunity for our three leads to interact as a trio, which does introduce some intriguing dynamics. I also didn't like the whole "let's have Sheryl fall over and have her breasts spill out of her dress so that she can slap the male lead for looking" moment - it's become a trope and it's a lazy one at that. That being said, having Sheryl encourage Ranka is a nice touch that lets us know early that Sheryl isn't just a diva, though she is most certainly that. It's also nice to get more of a budding relationship between Ranka and Alto, and to see Sheryl's reaction to the early signs of it. Anyway, what's most interesting about this episode is that we learn more about Ranka and her condition built in part off of past trauma. We get more on this in Episode 4, but her "brother" does seem really devoted to helping her, even as he's still putting himself in harm's way against her wishes. I did feel kind of frustrated that we haven't seen that decision on his part yield any kind of resentment or frustration from Ranka, as you would think that it would be more than a one-off "you told me you weren't doing this anymore" situation. Episode 4 Alto gets hazed and tests into the ranks of the SMS while Ranka has to deal with a Miss Macross competition where big-breasted women make her feel inadequate and she sings a Kyun Kyun and then falls over. Classic Ranka. Anyway, he passes his test after killing a Vajra with a discarded weapon (the tech for which is only hinted at here), and Ranka loses, possibly due to some kind of judge interference, though that's only hinted. We get a few other subtle moments. Alto's dad appears for the first time and basically treats his son as though he has long since disowned him. The pilot that Alto faced off against during his test is normally very large and shrinks herself down to mini waifu size for outings, which is bound to yield some fun. Alto also had to leave Ranka's competition suddenly for the test, and though she's quick to let that go, I'm fine with that. I was hoping we could skip the manufactured tension that would result from that, and it seems we have. |
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| @cipheron interesting thanks. I haven't heard of Kabuki before. I'm familiar with female roles in plays being played by men, Tudor plays in England were the same, women weren't trusted to act so young males took on the parts instead. I had the wrong end of the stick but in a different way. I thought Alto's dad was a GAR type male and was disappointed that his son was involved in drama and playing female roles and wouldn't take on his company (wasn't sure what that was though). Good to get clarification. Joshiraku has been suggested in our Interest Thread for a future group watch although we haven't gotten around to it yet. Episode 5. I like the tidbits of info we get on the fleet and general situation of the galaxy fleet at the beginning of each episode, eg how this frontier fleet has a main city and then industrial, agriculture and holiday ships accompanying it. Silly trapped in a locker scene, another harem/ecchi trope. I love Ranka's plushie phone and her fighter jet shaped backpack, lovely little touches. We learn that implants are artificial biological enhancements, but why does Sheryl have one as her earring? Maybe to help her sing? Sheryl seems quite fond of Alto, teasing him and asking about any potential girlfriend and his relationship with Ranka. This is a softer side of Sheryl we see on her date with Alto. We see a Zentradi ship where everything is huge, looks quite cool. Enjoyed the insert song from Ranka. The love triangle is really moving forward quickly. Sheryl gives Alto a kiss on the cheek which is observed by Ranka, who is clearly quite smitten with Alto. So Sheryl is in top spot, having managed to turn Alto's head so to speak, and Ranka is now the underdog. Come on Ranka! |
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cipheron said: 23feanor said: Joshiraku has been suggested in our Interest Thread for a future group watch although we haven't gotten around to it yet. I actually had Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu in mind. For comparison as far as rankings go, Joshiraku is ranked #1765 whereas Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu is ranked #83. One is a wacky schoolgirl comedy from the creator of Zetsubou Sensei, while the other is in depth historical drama / tragedy / comedy covering several decades of time. I'm sure Joshiraku is fun, but the other one is just on another level. Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu has already been watched by a number of people in our group watches so was a non starter, although it's a show I want to get around to eventually. |
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| Episode 5 A light and carefree episode, a parallel montage of two dates Alto/Sheryl and Ranka/Michel Blanc (her bro's superior and classmate). They explore the city in the gigantic Macross Frontier ship. It's rather pretty and wealthy, with a lot of nature. A lot of Zentradi live here, in their real size - much to Sheryl's surprise as she isn't used to that from her Macross Galaxy home. Ranka meets Michel by accident, after an argument with her brother about her singing career dreams. He puts her to the test, and a spontaneous performance in a shopping mall works very well. Here they meet Alto and Sheryl, the latter is also impressed. She's flirting rather aggressively with Alto, culminating in a fare well kiss at the end of the date. But the peaceful dating seems to be the calm before the storm. During a joint visit by UN Spacy and SMS soldiers, a captured Vajra wakes up and almost escapes. The cliffhanger has a ship from the Macross Galaxy approaching via a fault with news that the Galaxy fleet is under Vajra attack. Overall, I don't completely get how the two pairings happened. They all seem to have a lot of spare time. The real star is the ship and it's city / farming areas. The Macross Frontier is a nice place to live, and soon to fight for I guess. |
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| Episode 6. Why does Michael have such pointed elf like ears, is he part Zentradi as well, as I don't remember them having such pointy ears? So the frontier fleet learns that the Varja have attacked the main galaxy fleet. Ranka gets scouted. I really like the launch sequence for the fighters, looks so clean. Reminds me a little of Battlestar Galactica. Alto and Sheryl continue to makes connections and she lends him her lucky charm earring. Nice song from Sheryl at the end cut with scenes of the SMS ship leaving the frontier fleet to fight. This was was I expected when i watched the original Macross, lots of songs mixed with scenes of space battles and was mildly disappointed when the same song (Kyun Kyun) was reused over and over again at key points. Macross F is doing a great job so far, looks and sounds great. |
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| i found it on a streaming site and i will be joining all of you. |
 Active Military, Prior Service and Veteran's Anime Club do not forget the sound of my voice until the day we reunite |
| Episode 5 Not a lot to talk about this episode. Ranka gets a backbone and performs in public in a location that just so happens to feature Alto and Sheryl, the former of whom is being blackmailed to get back his tag from the depths Sheryl's ample bosom. We really get more of an idea of how the city looks and we get to see more the Zentradi and how they live. There's some light tension just before the end when Sheryl gives Alto a kiss on the cheek, which is witnessed by just about everyone of consequence... I'm sure that won't create any issues in upcoming episodes... In more serious news, Ranka's singing brings to life a long-dormant captured Vajra, so that's still happening without explanation. Sheryl's home ships, the Galaxy fleet, are attacked by the Vajra, which leads directly into... Episode 6 Ranka got scouted. Good for her. Alto tries to return Sheryl's earing (which she lost a couple of episodes back), but she tells him to keep it as a good luck charm. Not sure I buy this budding romance, but hey, it's happening. Alto also lies to Ranka's face about having been with Sheryl on his outing, something she knows isn't true. This is the kind of manufactured tension I'm really not fond of, since it's basically pointless not to tell her and, given that Michael had revealed that he had seen the kiss, he should have just assumed that Ranka was privy as well. It also just feels unnecessary. They had all met together before, and Ranka knew that Sheryl had been actively seeking Alto out. Just tell her you got dragged along on an outing. Oh, and that pesky attack happened. Some crazy stuff occurs with the scouts and the ships that were attacked suddenly appearing through folds in space, though a lot of that remains unexplained by the end of the episode. I'm sure this will be explored more later, but the concepts of the folds in space being used to move long distances is pretty neat. |
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| @Antalk good to have you back, hope you're doing ok. @whiteflame55 I kind of agree on the budding romance between Alto and Sheryl, it does feel a little forced, but that seems down to Sheryl. She's a huge idol and sees something or someone she wants and expects them to comply. Given her looks and status not many guys would be able to resist such temptation and it appears Alto is no exception. Hoping Ranka makes a comeback later on. Episode 7. I'm loving these action sequences with background music. That was a cool as hell episode. The varja mothership appears and all hell breaks loose. Luca is captured and Alto goes in to rescue him, only to be saved by a pink coloured fighter (I initially thought this was Clan but turns out it's a guy with white hair). Then the SMS ship transforms like the original Macross, wow looked so good and loved the pilot and his attack noises. Only thing that didn't look as good was the explosion but that's only a minor detail. Another good ED. |
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| Episode 8. We get to hear about the protoculture that we saw in Macross Zero, I'm guessing they have something to do with the Varja. Loved Ranka's carrot song, great piece of light comedy. Ranka transfers to Alto, Michael and Luca's school, and is about to be treated as the centre of attention, until Sheryl turns up. It seems Sheryl acts up as a tsundere when people are watching calling Alto her slave. Then she gets egg on her face, literally, when trying the flying equipment. Then we get a silly panty chase sequence ending in Alto saving Sheryl again. Ranka's job cancels her appearance due to Sheryl and she meets the pilot of the mysterious pink craft that helped Alto save Luca. Is it her brother maybe? |
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| In episode 6 Ranka is scouted and contracted by a pro from the entertainment industry. Sheryl prepares her final concert, and SMS goes into emergency mode for the pending assault of the Vajra. Frontier's political leader, Howard Glass, gives an official TV statement on that. Episode 7 then is a proven parallel montage of SMS's space battle against the Vajra and Sheryl's concert. Alto enters a Vajra ship on his rescue mission for Luca, who got captured. Impressive imagery and action sequences all over the episode. Then comes episode 8 which is a massive tonal shift into silly high school ecchi comedy. Used pantsu hunting, really? cipheron said: It's not so much that I can't follow the story, it's more a problem with the writing style. I'm missing connections and motivations, the story so far feels more like a loosely connected string of events and tropes. The frequent and stupid ecchi scenes aren't helping my enjoyment either. I feel reminded of Sidonia no Kishi (2014), a show with a similar premise than Macross F (in "recommendation" short lists on both MAL and anidb). Especially season 2 was completely destroyed by the weird tonal shifts (murderous battle followed by careless ecchi comedy rinse repeat) and I'm surprised to find the same in Macross F as well now. Not as bad as in Sidonia, which for my taste was really destroyed by that writing style. But I'm not a big fan of the Macross F writing so far, tbh. I think @whiteflame55 has similar issues, at least this is how I parse summaries like this: inim said: Well, Sheryl has no commitments on the ship, and she ambushed Alto at the end of the previous episode to find her earring [...]Overall, I don't completely get how the two pairings happened. They all seem to have a lot of spare time. whiteflame55 said: Overall, I'm a bit torn for Macross F, a number of writing features feel uncomfortable. The visuals are of course fantastic, and the world is detailed and immersive as one can expect from a major franchise. Yet, I always have that nagging "but ..." in my head while watching.Not sure I buy this budding romance, but hey, it's happening. Alto also lies to Ranka's face about having been with Sheryl on his outing, something she knows isn't true. This is the kind of manufactured tension I'm really not fond of, since it's basically pointless not to tell her and, given that Michael had revealed that he had seen the kiss, he should have just assumed that Ranka was privy as well. It also just feels unnecessary. They had all met together before, and Ranka knew that Sheryl had been actively seeking Alto out. Just tell her you got dragged along on an outing. |
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| @inim I'm also in agreement about the ecchi/harem tropes that keep getting inserted, I mentally roll my eyes every time. It feels very different to the original Macross, which had it's saucy moments (the Zentradi spies learning about our culture through sex shops, prostitution and dating is one that comes to mind), but the ecchi/harem tropes we're now familiar with (falling into a naked girl and getting slapped, seeing her pants etc) didn't exist when the original Macross aired, well not as fully formed and recognisable tropes such as we label them now. It feels like the show is throwing these ecchi parts into the show to appeal to a different audience than the original Macross, the school scenes as well. Which is fine if that's what the show intends (I love my ecchi/harem, but not dropped into shows out of place), however, i also think it detracts from the action and actual story lines (varja, alien mythology and romance). |
23feanorMay 26, 2022 9:35 AM
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inim said: It's not so much that I can't follow the story, it's more a problem with the writing style. I'm missing connections and motivations, the story so far feels more like a loosely connected string of events and tropes. The frequent and stupid ecchi scenes aren't helping my enjoyment either. I feel reminded of Sidonia no Kishi (2014), a show with a similar premise than Macross F (in "recommendation" short lists on both MAL and anidb). Especially season 2 was completely destroyed by the weird tonal shifts (murderous battle followed by careless ecchi comedy rinse repeat) and I'm surprised to find the same in Macross F as well now. Not as bad as in Sidonia, which for my taste was really destroyed by that writing style. But I'm not a big fan of the Macross F writing so far, tbh. I think @whiteflame55 has similar issues, at least this is how I parse summaries like this: whiteflame55 said: Overall, I'm a bit torn for Macross F, a number of writing features feel uncomfortable. The visuals are of course fantastic, and the world is detailed and immersive as one can expect from a major franchise. Yet, I always have that nagging "but ..." in my head while watching.Not sure I buy this budding romance, but hey, it's happening. Alto also lies to Ranka's face about having been with Sheryl on his outing, something she knows isn't true. This is the kind of manufactured tension I'm really not fond of, since it's basically pointless not to tell her and, given that Michael had revealed that he had seen the kiss, he should have just assumed that Ranka was privy as well. It also just feels unnecessary. They had all met together before, and Ranka knew that Sheryl had been actively seeking Alto out. Just tell her you got dragged along on an outing. You intuited correctly from my post. I'm not terribly fond of the writing in this series so far, and at least insofar as how these characters are interacting in matters of romance, I haven't been impressed. I haven't watched episode 8 yet (I'm taking to posting my thoughts on 2 episodes at a time), but it sounds like it will likely double down on the elements that I am not enjoying in this series. There's a lot to like here with regards to animation style and choreography, and I like the music as well, but the writing definitely suffers. |
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| @23feanor @whiteflame55 it would be wrong to write I'm "glad we agree". But it feels good to be not completely alone. As for the weird writing, it's not only the ecchi comedy (not sure we are entering harem yet?!). There's also the aspect of "lack of consequences". Let's use the latest example. Alto was involved into a major space battle against an enemy dangerous enough so the President himself makes a speech about the danger. Yet, not a single consequence is shown, no civil defense, no bunker scenes nor nothing. Life goes on, and so does Sheryl's concert. I don't blame Macross in particular here, parallel concert/space battle montages are the show's absolute trademark. Yet, at least one little consequence to make me feel as if an alien invasion mattered, please? The other example is when Alto returns from said battle. He entered one of their ships, and saw a mysterious clone of their own VF fighters. Not much is know about the aliens anyway. So shouldn't Alto be writing reports and working with military scientists on the aftermath? I mean, rather than hunting panties. Just saying ) |
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inim said: @23feanor @whiteflame55 it would be wrong to write I'm "glad we agree". But it feels good to be not completely alone. As for the weird writing, it's not only the ecchi comedy (not sure we are entering harem yet?!). There's also the aspect of "lack of consequences". Let's use the latest example. Alto was involved into a major space battle against an enemy dangerous enough so the President himself makes a speech about the danger. Yet, not a single consequence is shown, no civil defense, no bunker scenes nor nothing. Life goes on, and so does Sheryl's concert. I don't blame Macross in particular here, parallel concert/space battle montages are the show's absolute trademark. Yet, at least one little consequence to make me feel as if an alien invasion mattered, please? The other example is when Alto returns from said battle. He entered one of their ships, and saw a mysterious clone of their own VF fighters. Not much is know about the aliens anyway. So shouldn't Alto be writing reports and working with military scientists on the aftermath? I mean, rather than hunting panties. Just saying ) On reflection I think my main issue is that I wasn't expecting ecchi tropes in a Macross franchise show so it feel s a bit jarring. I've only seen Macross 1982, Macross Zero and Macross Plus (which both had a bit of nudity and/or sex, but relevant to the plot, although the naked priestess in the lake in Zero may have been a bit unnecessary) and none of those resorted to overt ecchi tropes in the writing. The animation, fight sequences and music in Macross F are really, really good though. |
23feanorMay 26, 2022 10:23 PM
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| Episode 9 develops the SMS pilots and their social web. Mikhail and Klang Klan are childhood friends and constantly bantering, yet not an official couple. I feel and hope there's more here, the show should have it's mixed race couple. I pretend I didn't hear that "in your micronized form it's child abuse" joke. There's drama inserted trough the backstory of Mikhael's sister Jessica, who like him was a sniper and accused to have murdered her former commander and lover during a military action. As a result, she committed suicide. Alto and Mikhail are developed as friendly rivals, exemplified by a trust issue about Mikhail's sniping skill. Reason: in a critical situation he misses and almost kills Alto. In Ranka's arc, she meets the mysterious harmonica player again but there's no contact. Her new manager Elmo has her doing a handkerchief handout promotion in a cat suit. Bobby Margot, SMS main ship's helmsman and resident gay character, doubles as her makeup artist. Queer eye for the straight 25% Zentradi girl. So Ranka is portrayed to work her way up the hard way. Finally Sheryl for promotion reasons "joins the pilot training", which isn't welcomed by all SMS pilots. Overall, a good episode developing relations by small scenes and dialog. Mikhail/Klan are a future couple, Ranka is a hard working girl, and Mikhail/Alto are the rough yet friendly military rivals. |
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| Episode 7 Pretty impressive episode that shows off the series' strong production values through an epic fight in space that includes a Vajra ship and a Vajra mech that's apparently piloted by a human who can play a mean harmonica. We also get an inventive concert from Sheryl who notably breaks down a bit in the middle, signifying that the events with her ship and the fight currently ongoing are having an effect on her that we rarely get to see. Alto gets a chance to be the hero and save a fellow pilot, everyone comes home safe. Episode 8 I can reduce this episode down to two words: tonal whiplash. It's fine to have an episode that has some levity after a heavy one, I get that, even if I'm not super into this manner of doing it. I recall a much better effort towards this end from Code Geass, for example, but a) that show didn't involve a girl running around in a skirt panty-less hunting a small green creature that randomly absconded with said panties, b) it didn't involve an active hunt on the part of many horny teenagers for said used panties, and most importantly c) the characters were clearly still affected by the prior events of the series. I could honestly accept a and b as just stupid baiting if it weren't for c, but it's kind of absurd just how quickly everyone seems to put those events behind them. Alto lost Sheryl's earing during his space battle where he almost died, but she chides him for losing it rather than showing any modicum of appreciation for the fact that he's still alive. I get that she's vain, but this was a bit much. There's some talk behind the scenes about quarantining people who came into contact with the enemy craft, but Alto is apparently free and clear despite being in closer contact than anyone beyond the guy he rescued. His rash actions cost him nothing except a ship and said earing. Sheryl put on a sold out show against the wishes of pretty much everyone leading the ship they're on, potentially putting everyone in danger, and no one even talks about it. Sheryl's sudden bout of emotion seems largely behind her at this point, since she now believes that the Galaxy is fine despite all evidence to the contrary and the loss of one of their biggest ships, which was probably full of people, some of whom she might have known. I don't know, maybe I'm just expecting too much in terms of how the hierarchy of this world functions and how these characters should behave based on past experience, but an episode like this really makes me question if I know these characters as well as I thought I did, with Sheryl looking particularly petty and arrogant. In any case, we get our harmonica boy meeting Ranka at the end, so there's clearly something interesting to look forward to, even if it's not in this episode. |
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| Episode 9. So we learn about Michael's sister and her death. Alto and Michael further develop a rivalry and grudging respect for each others talents. One major difference I've noticed already is that I appreciated the older age of the cast (just looked this up and Sheryl is older than Minmay at the start of both series, so I guess it's the settings and writing that makes Macross F characters feel younger) and settings of the original Macross, no school scenes. I think Macross F may have some of the best mecha fights and action sequences I've ever seen. Every one looks amazing. Michael clearly rattled when remembering his sister's death. Some trauma there, rounds out his character a bit. Is the fancy flirty behaviour all an act he puts on? Sheryl's manager, Grace seems a bit suspicious with her biotech implants and eavesdropping on the conference about the varja. Is she somehow connected to the varja (a spy maybe), or just trying to profit from the information she learns? I've noticed the Japanese call Michael the French "Michel" but it's spelled out Michael in the English subs and I'm guessing the German subs spell it Mikhail @inim? Interesting how we get slightly different variations on the same name. I've always thought that French and Japanese have some similar sounds and hearing them say 'Michel' in this show is very close to how the French pronounce the name. Klan and Michael, hmm, i like the fact they're shipping a mixed race couple, but why the hell did they make Klan a loli when she's micronised, I don't remember seeing any of the original Zentradi looking like this? It makes an potential pairing between them weird, as Michael points out (reminds me of Shinobu from Monogatari type deal, a legal loli). We see the pink fighter with the harmonica player inside leaving and it sounds like Grace is giving him instructions to destroy the varja nest before Frontier forces can find it and retrieve a sample. That would suggest there are people onboard sympathetic to the varja, or who know their true purpose or identity. |
23feanorMay 27, 2022 2:30 AM
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23feanor said: . German subs use Michael as well, the name is spelled that way in German too. Mikhail is what MAL uses, and so did I to stay consistent :)I've noticed the Japanese call Michael the French "Michel" but it's spelled out Michael in the English subs and I'm guessing the German subs spell it Mikhail |
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| Episode 10. So we begin with a film version of Macross Zero and Ranka is playing the younger sister, nice touch. So the whole episode is staged on a island set the replica of that in Macross Zero, but they're a retelling of the events through this film. Interesting type of meta within the Macross franchise, using their own past material as a setting and story device in their new material. So the mysterious stranger makes another appearance to save Ranka and Alto from what I'm guessing is a form of new varja. The newcomer is called Brera Sterne and he appears to be part android or have advanced biotech capabilities. Sounds like he's being controlled by Grace. Sheryl covers her jealousy at the prospect of Alto and Ranka kissing in the scene by kissing Alto first. Ranka steps up to the plate and plays Mao kissing Alto and singing the main song. Some lovely animation and backgrounds. Good episode tying in some history and mythology. |
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| Episode 10 Another wild continuity jump, now most of the cast is at a film set and holds some function in the film crew. Alto is a stunt double, and for some reason even unrelated side characters like Luca and Michael are on set. The Macross F narrative style to me is like this. The cast is a troupe of actors, who move from scene to scene with some loose overarching story, and then create the most melodramatic version of the setting. Everybody is given a part according to their character stereotype in each scene. The genre and setting of the scene is almost random, it can be a fierce space battle, a silly ecchi panty hunt, or now a showbiz drama. And after the episode is done, there are little to no consequences - we'll never see Alto again as a stunt double, his "film career" ends here. Then there are extreme self-referential content and story elements. In this episode we really see the filming of the Macross Zero OVA. They explain us that the VF-25 they use as prop will be digitally processed to look like a VF-0 from the early 2000s (when Zero takes place). This is fan service (non sexual) on crack, diving into lore and franchise trivia is rewarded by Easter eggs and references like I've never seen elsewhere. Story wise, we have said movie shooting on a paradise island. Ranka is initially hired as an extra ("Mayan Girl A") and ends up playing one of the mains (Mao Nome) and singing the title song. As if any expensive media production allowed tis late change. Speaking of Mao Nome: While her sister Sara and pilot Shin transcend, in the real events Mao survived. At least the German dub refers to the role as "Doctor Nome", a title Mao certainly didn't hold in 200x. Also, Sheryl Nome shares her last name. Weird coincidences, or plot in the making? We also meet Mr. Harmonica who saves Ranka (as damsel in distress) from a island monster. He introduces himself as Brera Sterne. His body is at least partly android, as shots from cables in injuries and the ability to morph his arm into a sword showcase. We also get more love triangle drama centered around kissing Alto. Ranka has to do it as per her role, and Sheryl just does it because she can. Overall, I slowly get used to the weirdly disconnected writing style of the show. It's not bad writing, just unusual. They know what they are doing, aren't they? |
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| Episode 11 Finally we war back to regularly scheduled plot progression, for almost all characters. The main focus is on Alto, of whom everybody wants a piece on his birthday. Ranka invites him for a date, Sheryl wants him to accompany her on her fold trip to a troop support concert, and Kabuki dad expects Alto to return to him and apologize so he can resume his actor career. Alto picks Sheryl's offer, leaving Ranka in a bittersweet mood. Ranka is shown to have turned into a rising idol, with a tight schedule, a lot of media presence, and soon a first concert in a large hall. Alto since his stunt double appearance in Macross Zero is pulled back by his family into his role as an actor dynasty heir, but is not interested at all. Klang Klan in a micronized shower scene exposition dumps the story of the 33rd Zentradi fleet on Galia 4, which Sheryl and Alto are traveling to. Grace gets a few shots showing her controlling communication and events, she has some plan. But it's not yet explained,only that Galia 4 seems to play a role in it. Overall, I'm really glad we are back into a normal narrative flow. Bittersweet triangle romance, generational family drama, a hard working Cinde-ranka, and the set-up for space action on Galia 4. The show is good when it abstains from fan service and self-referential "special episodes". |
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| Episode 9 I enjoyed this one. Getting to spend some time learning about a side character who has nonetheless played an important role in the series is usually a good time regardless, but this one come with some excellent fight scenes and some meaningful character growth, so it's pulling its weight. We also get hints of insight into what our harmonica-playing pilot is thinking, though he remains largely a mystery. Episode 10 Less enjoyment on this one, though at least it's better than episode 8. Another bit of digression from the main story, this one focuses more on Ranka's career coming into its own as she finds herself in the lead role for a movie and gets the opportunity to kiss Alto underwater for a stunt scene. There's a bit of heft to a fight with a weird chimera creature that attacks them only to be fought off by our harmonica lad, but it honestly looks a little janky, especially compared with the CGI space fights. Still, it's not a bad episode, just feels kinda weightless. |
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| @cipheron I also wondered about the out of control limo arriving at the school as it nearly careened into a bunch of students. Strange ojou-sama type entrance. Episode 11. So it's back to the main city fleet and usual order although now Ranka is a rising star. We learn that Luca's parents run a huge tech firm LAI, who have connections with Leon, he's a slippery guy who knows much more about Ranka and her past that he lets on. We also learn about the Zentradi fleet, or part of it (Naval Unit 33) that didn't like the fact they were connected to humans and had lost the first intergalactic war to culture. Alto gets some news about his dad and gets presented 3 options for his bday; see his dad, who will forgive him, see Sheryl and fly in an 'endless sky' or see Ranka at the park. That scene gave me a bit more insight into Alto when his acting brother said "you're still acting now, just playing the part of a rebellious child wanting to be a tough pilot". Alto choses to go with Sheryl to Gallia 4 to fly in an endless sky (an atmosphere). Grace and Leon are working together along with harmonica guy, who appears Grace's tool. One thing I don't get (or I do get it, but it' an anime/tv thing) is that you'd think Alto would simply call Ranka and say "sorry I can't make it to the park, I have to fly support for mission, why don't we meet up when I get back", rather than letting Ranka go all the way out to the park when she's busy and getting Michael to stand in and give her the message. It's just impractical, but increases the drama and tension. |
23feanorMay 29, 2022 4:48 AM
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| Episode 12. I wonder what Ranka's little green pet actually is, a baby Hydra (what are hydra btw?) or maybe a juvenile varja? The zentradi rebel on Gallia 4 when Sheryl is to sick to sing. Ranka comes to the rescue. Reminded me of the second arc in Macross, weak episode although slightly improved by Alto flying through the sky with Ranka instead of Sheryl and the nice songs. |
23feanorMay 30, 2022 4:06 AM
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