Puella Magi Madoka Magica: The Movie -Rebellion-
What do you think of Homura after her role in Rebellion?
GibsonFlyingV said: Because it's annoying. That's all.Botato said: I don't understand why there has to be closure. The ending was explained just enough if the viewer understood character motives and personalities. The beauty in the ending is the ambiguity over whether or not the ending was satisfactory for the characters. Although Madoka's law was rewritten, technically all of the characters ended up with normal healthy lives. So was what Homura did really all that bad? Was the ending actually one of tragedy or happiness? These open ended questions are what made this movie great, and I don't understand why people think it needs to be further wrapped up.That's true but it's not what I'm talking about. Uhhh okay? I don't want a happy ending, just a more resolved ending because I didn't find Rebellion's ending satisfying enough as a "closure" to the story. |
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| We dont want a sequel that explains shit(although an official explanation of how Akuma Komura's powers work would be good...you know... except from "love" and "not a witch"). We want to know how the rest of the ex-magical girls will react to her world and how they will rebel if they rebel. With the exception of Homura it really isnt a tragedy for the other chars.But that doesnt mean that this world is safe or that it will last.Even Homura knows that. |
ssjokg said: We want to know how the rest of the ex-magical girls will react to her world and how they will rebel if they rebel. THIS^ The ending heavily implied that at least Sayaka will be rebelling, and that there will be a continuation to the story and that it isn't over yet. Making a cliff hanger ending like that and then never following up on it is cruel and horrible. |
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| [quote=Botato] THIS^ The ending heavily implied that at least Sayaka will be rebelling/quote] Well given how Shinbo is a complete Sayaka fanboy, it's possible that she would be the protagonist of the next movie/series. |
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HeisenDurden said: He is? Then he's officially cool in my book :)Botato said: THIS^ The ending heavily implied that at least Sayaka will be rebelling Well given how Shinbo is a complete Sayaka fanboy, it's possible that she would be the protagonist of the next movie/series. |
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Botato said: HeisenDurden said: He is? Then he's officially cool in my book :)Well given how Shinbo is a complete Sayaka fanboy, it's possible that she would be the protagonist of the next movie/series. Shinbo liked Sayaka's character so much, that he asked Gen if he could spare her in the finale. Of course Urouchi said no, because he's Urobuchi. |
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HeisenDurden said: Yeah I hated him when he did that.Botato said: He is? Then he's officially cool in my book :) Shinbo liked Sayaka's character so much, that he asked Gen if he could spare her in the finale. Of course Urouchi said no, because he's Urobuchi. Thank God for Rebellion. |
BotatoJun 20, 2014 9:48 PM
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Botato said: But he brought her back in Rebellion....HeisenDurden said: Yeah I hate him for that.Shinbo liked Sayaka's character so much, that he asked Gen if he could spare her in the finale. Of course Urouchi said no, because he's Urobuchi. |
ssjokg said: But he brought her back in Rebellion.... Fixed it to make it more clear :P |
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ssjokg said: There really isn't all that much that they CAN do given that they all lost their memories, they are no longer wielders of any power, and Homura is now the most powerful character in the Universe. Miki Sayaka even said that she would only remember that Homura was the devil and she would forever hold contempt for her. The series was pretty much wrapped up in the sense that all the girls (not Homura) were now just normal girls with normal lives just like Homura wanted. All the responsibility of handling curses and despair was put on the Incubators which is made clear through her words and Kyubey's eye details in the post-credit scene.We dont want a sequel that explains shit(although an official explanation of how Akuma Komura's powers work would be good...you know... except from "love" and "not a witch"). We want to know how the rest of the ex-magical girls will react to her world and how they will rebel if they rebel. With the exception of Homura it really isnt a tragedy for the other chars.But that doesnt mean that this world is safe or that it will last.Even Homura knows that. And furthermore, if what you wanted was a closure that involved perfect happiness and resolution between all of the characters and their lives, that would be doing the entire saga a huge disservice. Even the original series had somewhat of an unsatisfactory ending with Madoka no longer existing and the old Mahou Shoujo still having to battle wraiths and disappear altogether eventually. Part of the original ending's purpose was to establish that nothing will ever end completely how everyone would want it, which is consistent with the ending in Rebellion. |
sgtnannersJun 20, 2014 10:21 PM
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
| Homura herself states that she will eventually be their enemy.So she doesnt have total control and they CAN do something, especially Madoka. When did I say that I want a happy ending for everyone? |
ssjokg said: I didn't say you did, hence the "if". And just because Homura becomes the "enemy" doesn't necessarily mean they can do all that much to her besides hate her. It was never stated that they could do anything against her considering the word "enemies" only entails opposition. I can maybe imagine Madoka regaining her powers and maybe trying to undo Homura's new world, but honestly that would be stupid and not all that fun to watch in my opinion. If they truly create another installment in this series, I can only see it go downhill from here. The only reason why they would create anything more is to milk the fanbase of its money because the producers know that people will spend it.Homura herself states that she will eventually be their enemy.So she doesnt have total control and they CAN do something, especially Madoka. When did I say that I want a happy ending for everyone? |
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
GibsonFlyingV said: But according to this they already had plans for a sequel before Rebellion was even made.ssjokg said: I didn't say you did, hence the "if". And just because Homura becomes the "enemy" doesn't necessarily mean they can do all that much to her besides hate her. It was never stated that they could do anything against her considering the word "enemies" only entails opposition. I can maybe imagine Madoka regaining her powers and maybe trying to undo Homura's new world, but honestly that would be stupid and not all that fun to watch in my opinion. If they truly create another installment in this series, I can only see it go downhill from here. The only reason why they would create anything more is to milk the fanbase of its money because the producers know that people will spend it.Homura herself states that she will eventually be their enemy.So she doesnt have total control and they CAN do something, especially Madoka. When did I say that I want a happy ending for everyone? |
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Botato said: I have yet to see any official information about future Madoka. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I want to see an actual source.GibsonFlyingV said: But according to this they already had plans for a sequel before Rebellion was even made.I didn't say you did, hence the "if". And just because Homura becomes the "enemy" doesn't necessarily mean they can do all that much to her besides hate her. It was never stated that they could do anything against her considering the word "enemies" only entails opposition. I can maybe imagine Madoka regaining her powers and maybe trying to undo Homura's new world, but honestly that would be stupid and not all that fun to watch in my opinion. If they truly create another installment in this series, I can only see it go downhill from here. The only reason why they would create anything more is to milk the fanbase of its money because the producers know that people will spend it. |
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
| Stupid or not, Madoka regaining her powers means that Homura doesnt have complete control. Isnt what Botato posted "actual source"? |
ssjokg said: Just saying that there is a future for the project doesn't mean a continuation of this specific series. There are many specific spinoffs and Urobuchi even said that he may not even be involved, which in my honest opinion, doesn't bode well at all even if there is a future continuation. There is nothing officially saying that they will even do anything anymore. "Plans" are literally just "plans" until they come into fruition.Stupid or not, Madoka regaining her powers means that Homura doesnt have complete control. Isnt what Botato posted "actual source"? |
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
ssjokg said: And furthermore, the ending of Rebellion wasn't even added until they were mostly finished with the actual thing. The "twist" ending was a last minute addition that was worked on by Shinbou and Urobuchi together to give the movie a more distinctive feel. This "source" was posted long before the ending to Rebellion was even made. And considering that the movie literally ended with the words "Fin" I think most people who talk about Madoka's future are just overly hopeful. Stupid or not, Madoka regaining her powers means that Homura doesnt have complete control. Isnt what Botato posted "actual source"? |
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
GibsonFlyingV said: ssjokg said: Just saying that there is a future for the project doesn't mean a continuation of this specific series. There are many specific spinoffs and Urobuchi even said that he may not even be involved, which in my honest opinion, doesn't bode well at all even if there is a future continuation. There is nothing officially saying that they will even do anything anymore. "Plans" are literally just "plans" until they come into fruition.Stupid or not, Madoka regaining her powers means that Homura doesnt have complete control. Isnt what Botato posted "actual source"? It can be a spin off and still take place inside Homura's world you know. Saying that there will be nothing because it's just plans is very childish thinking. GibsonFlyingV said: ssjokg said: And furthermore, the ending of Rebellion wasn't even added until they were mostly finished with the actual thing. The "twist" ending was a last minute addition that was worked on by Shinbou and Urobuchi together to give the movie a more distinctive feel. This "source" was posted long before the ending to Rebellion was even made. And considering that the movie literally ended with the words "Fin" I think most people who talk about Madoka's future are just overly hopeful. Stupid or not, Madoka regaining her powers means that Homura doesnt have complete control. Isnt what Botato posted "actual source"? Whether it was a last minute addition or rot, there is no official source that says that any future project is DROPPED.There is no reason to dismiss it. The tv series ended with "fin"(in runes) as well. Not to mention that Urobuchi WASNT planning a continuation of the tv series and we still got Rebellion. What I am trying to say is this:"For whatever reason we will get more Madoka anime". |
ssjokg said: I would love for you to screencap these "runes" spelling "fin" at the end of the TV series for me. Spinoffs are spinoffs. They are not continuations. Madoka Magica is its own thing. The universe in which it resides is the Puella Magi series. If there is more Puella Magi, it doesn't necessarily mean more Madoka at all!GibsonFlyingV said: Just saying that there is a future for the project doesn't mean a continuation of this specific series. There are many specific spinoffs and Urobuchi even said that he may not even be involved, which in my honest opinion, doesn't bode well at all even if there is a future continuation. There is nothing officially saying that they will even do anything anymore. "Plans" are literally just "plans" until they come into fruition. It can be a spin off and still take place inside Homura's world you know. Saying that there will be nothing because it's just plans is very childish thinking. GibsonFlyingV said: And furthermore, the ending of Rebellion wasn't even added until they were mostly finished with the actual thing. The "twist" ending was a last minute addition that was worked on by Shinbou and Urobuchi together to give the movie a more distinctive feel. This "source" was posted long before the ending to Rebellion was even made. And considering that the movie literally ended with the words "Fin" I think most people who talk about Madoka's future are just overly hopeful. Whether it was a last minute addition or rot, there is no official source that says that any future project is DROPPED.There is no reason to dismiss it. The tv series ended with "fin"(in runes) as well. Not to mention that Urobuchi WASNT planning a continuation of the tv series and we still got Rebellion. What I am trying to say is this:"For whatever reason we will get more Madoka anime". You cannot "drop" anything that doesn't yet exist. By saying there is a desire to do something, it does not mean that it will ever actually be done. As it is right now, there is nothing in the works at all. Maybe there has been thoughts about where it might go, but there has yet to be any initiative in beginning anything new. Rebellion planning began immediately after the finishing of the original Madoka series broadcast in 2011. Furthermore, Urobuchi already said that he believes he has already completely flushed out the canon universe in Madoka Magica and any "sequels" will probably be fanfics, unless they hire a completely new writer to take over the series for him. And by the way, how is what I said about "plans" anything in the realm of childish at all? How many series, especially in anime, have had "planned" futures that never actually result to anything? Too many to count. Granted it's probably more likely for the Madoka series given their endless money supply and anything is indeed possible, but that one statement is so ridiculous. And until anything continuing the Madoka canon even begins to be worked on, that "childish thinking" is more valid than any speculation that any hopeful fans can come up with. |
sgtnannersJun 21, 2014 12:13 PM
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
| http://wiki.puella-magi.net/Runes:Episode_12 MAny spinoffs built up stuff that were left without closure in a main series. So your reasoning is there are no recent news so another series is impossible ....yeah that is why it is childish.THAT is one hell of a speculation. Point is there are news for another series regardless of when they were released.There are no news to say that there wont be.Which side makes most speculations? |
ssjokg said: So you continue to try to insult me, and with things that I never even stated? Since when did I say it would be impossible? All I have been saying is that it is NOT inevitable! Speculation? Please. Besides that one "source" linked by Botato, I have not heard a single thing about any future for the series. In fact, the majority of interviews by Shinbou and Urobuchi themselves all state that there are no concrete PLANS for ANYTHING. Everything they have said post-Rebellion relates to the viewer interpretation of the ending they created, and leaving it open for fans to try and end the series in their own different ways. If you can find me another source besides that single one that was posted before Rebellion was even made, then maybe I can take what all of you are saying seriously. But yes, until you do what you are saying IS indeed speculation. It is speculation to every part of the definition of the word.http://wiki.puella-magi.net/Runes:Episode_12 MAny spinoffs built up stuff that were left without closure in a main series. So your reasoning is there are no recent news so another series is impossible ....yeah that is why it is childish.THAT is one hell of a speculation. Point is there are news for another series regardless of when they were released.There are no news to say that there wont be.Which side makes most speculations? |
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
GibsonFlyingV said: I think I missed the interview when he stated this, could you quickly link it to me, if you don't mind?Furthermore, Urobuchi already said that he believes he has already completely flushed out the canon universe in Madoka Magica and any "sequels" will probably be fanfics, unless they hire a completely new writer to take over the series for him. Yes it is speculation, which is why all we were saying in the beginning is that we want a sequel and why we want it. You claimed that if they create more they would only be milking the series, which is why I linked that news thread. If they make a sequel, they're NOT "milking" since they said they will continue from before the huge success of Rebellion. And since we are speculating: Shaft already had their hands full with Nisekoi and Mekaku City Actors, and Hanamonogatari which is coming this summer. It's possible that an announcement regarding a Madoka project (sequel, spin off, anything, ..) when they are done with these projects. If they want to make a sequel, I think actual planning and writing staff meetings will be done towards the end of this year and we may never hear a formal announcement until next year in worst case scenario. Edit: To add to my last point, Urobuchi will be busy this summer with Aldnoah.Zero and in the fall with Psycho-Pass 2 and next year in the winter there's a Psycho-Pass movie, so that makes the worst case scenario even more likely. |
BotatoJun 21, 2014 12:55 PM
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Botato said: http://feral-phoenix.livejournal.com/685568.htmlGibsonFlyingV said: I think I missed the interview when he stated this, could you quickly link it to me, if you don't mind?Furthermore, Urobuchi already said that he believes he has already completely flushed out the canon universe in Madoka Magica and any "sequels" will probably be fanfics, unless they hire a completely new writer to take over the series for him. Yes it is speculation, which is why all we were saying in the beginning is that we want a sequel and why we want it. You claimed that if they create more they would only be milking the series, which is why I linked that news thread. If they make a sequel, they're NOT "milking" since they said they will continue from before the huge success of Rebellion. And since we are speculating: Shaft already had their hands full with Nisekoi and Mekaku City Actors, and Hanamonogatari which is coming this summer. It's possible that an announcement regarding a Madoka project (sequel, spin off, anything, ..) when they are done with these projects. If they want to make a sequel, I think actual planning and writing staff meetings will be done towards the end of this year and we may never hear a formal announcement until next year in worst case scenario. These are interview with Shinbou and Gen from the pamphlet of the Madoka Magica: Rebellion movie. Like I said, I don't think it is impossible for a continuation from here. But from everything that I read about Gen's views of where the series can go, he seems completely uninterested in further stretching it out. As I stated earlier, if there is a continuation, Gen will probably not even be involved which does a lot to say about the potential quality of the new series/movie if it is indeed created. When I say "Milking", that only means continuously making more of a franchise with the intent of taking advantage of past success. So Rebellion being successful doesn't have all that much to do with it unless it absolutely bombed. Edit: And to clarify, I am ok with more Madoka Magica because I love Madoka Magica. However, I am not okay with creating more and more until the series become only a shell of what it originally was and is more about making money and less about the quality of the work. I see way too many series fall into that trap. I'm looking at you especially Chuunibyou. |
sgtnannersJun 21, 2014 1:07 PM
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
| 1. Shinbou says at the end of his interview that if they can, they will. It's possible to continue the franchise so I don't see why not. 2. When Urobuchi said "Madoka" he meant the character not the series itself. And he said that he did all he thinks there is to do for Homura's character. But nothing about denying any sequels. And like I pointed out, it was hinted in Rebellion's ending that Sayaka will be an important character in a potential sequel. They can make her the protagonist instead of the fully fleshed out Madoka and Homura. 3. The part where he says he wants people to make their own sequels may mean he's not interested in a sequel at the moment, but as the first few questions in the interview revealed he wasn't thinking of a sequel to the TV series either so things can change. Like I said give him some time to finish his other projects. tl;dr From what I understand, Shinbou wants to if there's room for one, and there IS. Gen is not interested currently but may change his mind since: it's happened before, and at this time he's busy so maybe when he's done. |
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GibsonFlyingV said: ssjokg said: So you continue to try to insult me, and with things that I never even stated? Since when did I say it would be impossible? All I have been saying is that it is NOT inevitable! Speculation? Please. Besides that one "source" linked by Botato, I have not heard a single thing about any future for the series. In fact, the majority of interviews by Shinbou and Urobuchi themselves all state that there are no concrete PLANS for ANYTHING. Everything they have said post-Rebellion relates to the viewer interpretation of the ending they created, and leaving it open for fans to try and end the series in their own different ways. If you can find me another source besides that single one that was posted before Rebellion was even made, then maybe I can take what all of you are saying seriously. But yes, until you do what you are saying IS indeed speculation. It is speculation to every part of the definition of the word.http://wiki.puella-magi.net/Runes:Episode_12 MAny spinoffs built up stuff that were left without closure in a main series. So your reasoning is there are no recent news so another series is impossible ....yeah that is why it is childish.THAT is one hell of a speculation. Point is there are news for another series regardless of when they were released.There are no news to say that there wont be.Which side makes most speculations? Calling your opinion childish isnt insulting.You cant come and say that YOUR speculation is right or more "valid" than of "hopeful" fans, without basing it on something(like a fucking source that you so much demand but never give), and isnt contradictory ofc, and think that I will just call it brilliant reasoning. That one source is still a source.I dont have to find as many as YOU WANt till you think that it is ok. Compared to your speculation that is based on the "interpretation of the ending" it is FAR more valid. Regardless of when Gen wrote the end we saw, the ending he had originally planned was a TRUE ENDING which didnt need any interpretation and it had no need for a sequel, with Homura and MAdoka as characters at least. Rebellion is far from it, and be it Gen or not they can still make a story with those two even if they are side characters. You wanna play with words?How is saying "they are not making one" and give out reasons for that(although they dont prove anything) any different from impossible.You are making it out to be unnecessary.Impossible is an ok words to use. Furthermore Madoka doesnt need Gen to be good.Any capable writer that can just stick to the canon and established laws of the series can make it(not Nagai), and if the series has only new chars then it is even easier. |
ssjokg said: This is going to be the last thing I add, and I won't continue the sequel discussion. GibsonFlyingV said: So you continue to try to insult me, and with things that I never even stated? Since when did I say it would be impossible? All I have been saying is that it is NOT inevitable! Speculation? Please. Besides that one "source" linked by Botato, I have not heard a single thing about any future for the series. In fact, the majority of interviews by Shinbou and Urobuchi themselves all state that there are no concrete PLANS for ANYTHING. Everything they have said post-Rebellion relates to the viewer interpretation of the ending they created, and leaving it open for fans to try and end the series in their own different ways. If you can find me another source besides that single one that was posted before Rebellion was even made, then maybe I can take what all of you are saying seriously. But yes, until you do what you are saying IS indeed speculation. It is speculation to every part of the definition of the word. Calling your opinion childish isnt insulting.You cant come and say that YOUR speculation is right or more "valid" than of "hopeful" fans, without basing it on something(like a fucking source that you so much demand but never give), and isnt contradictory ofc, and think that I will just call it brilliant reasoning. That one source is still a source.I dont have to find as many as YOU WANt till you think that it is ok. Compared to your speculation that is based on the "interpretation of the ending" it is FAR more valid. Regardless of when Gen wrote the end we saw, the ending he had originally planned was a TRUE ENDING which didnt need any interpretation and it had no need for a sequel, with Homura and MAdoka as characters at least. Rebellion is far from it, and be it Gen or not they can still make a story with those two even if they are side characters. You wanna play with words?How is saying "they are not making one" and give out reasons for that(although they dont prove anything) any different from impossible.You are making it out to be unnecessary.Impossible is an ok words to use. Furthermore Madoka doesnt need Gen to be good.Any capable writer that can just stick to the canon and established laws of the series can make it(not Nagai), and if the series has only new chars then it is even easier. First of all, don't quote me on things that I didn't say. When did I EVER say "they are not making one"? Does me questioning the plausibility of a sequel enable you to make such an assumption of my views? This entire time, I have been constantly referencing the possible event in which they they do make a continuation! Furthermore, the entire point I was trying to make, originally, was that they SHOULDN'T make a sequel, and that is only my opinion. I never said that it was never going to happen. The only thing I did say was that currently, Urobuchi stated, himself, that he feels he has flushed through the characters of Madoka and Homura, who happen to be central to the entire series! Maybe it's only my interpretation of his own words, but he seems skeptical that he would be involved in any future Madoka works should they be made. He himself has said that he would strive to find new writers to take his place in the event that they ever did. And this one link that Botato posted can indeed be a "source", but as it stands I see it as an unproven source with little credibility. Without any confirmation, its validity means no more than if I were to say anything myself and reference THAT at as a source. All I was asking was for you to prove it and find me further evidence of work on future Madoka. I wanted you to find me another area where I could further research these things you called "future plans". Unfortunately, any other sources of information confirming this don't seem to exist! If these plans were so relevant, why have I not heard of anything of the sort outside of that one post on a MAL forum, which honestly doesn't exactly have any form of reputability??? Second, what I am saying cannot be speculation by the definition of the damn word. I am saying that there isn't any proof of further work being made, and currently no continuation of the franchise has been announced! That is a FACT and it is NOT speculation. This entire time, I have been asking you to disprove this, and the only thing you have done is provide technicalities to discredit what you take as my opinion. To this day, nothing has been announced, so yes, what I am saying is FAR more valid than anything you contemplate to be true. If you don't understand that, then there is nothing I can do. Furthermore, there is no need for me to provide a source to prove what I am saying. Considering that, as of now, the current state of the franchise is frozen until an announcement for further work is made, what can I even provide as a source to prove something that is already a solid truth? Would I need to provide a source for the fact that my children don't yet exist, although I definitely have plans to have them in the future? What you say makes absolutely no sense. And if there is a future for Madoka without Gen, only time will tell if it is actually any good. I can admit to being a Gen fanboy, and a Madoka without Gen may be a Madoka that I, personally, am not interested in. But like I said, time will tell. And with this, I leave you. I apologize Dedodede for providing false statements, as I had originally thought that that was indeed the case. I had read that original statement from an article about Urobuchi and the ending of Rebellion, and I guess I shouldn't have taken it seriously unless it had provided information for reference. |
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
| And by the way, here is your source you've been asking for. And this one is an ACTUAL source. http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2013-12-07 After Rebellion, do you have any plans for the Madoka franchise in the future? Iwakami: No, we don't have any plans. The world of Madoka is great, and I love all the characters, so personally, if we have a great plot scenario, I personally would love to make something else Madoka. But at this point, as of right now, we don't have any official plans. |
sgtnannersJun 21, 2014 10:45 PM
| Men always seem to think about their past before they die, as though he were frantically searching for proof that he truly lived. |
| You are making a wrong assumption since we have info about the franchise continuing.Be it Gen or not doesnt matter.It is something even those news stated. So the source from a magazine by an interview with Urobuchi is an unproven source with little credibility.Ok... If you didnt read it anywhere else it is your problem and of other communities, not of MAL. Just like MAl doesnt include every single piece of news or interviews . But there is proof.You just deny it for no reason.THere are plans for new series be it continuation or not.Saying that "there is no clear news about what they will be about" equals" no plans at all" is stupid. ANd once more yes you have to provide a source especially when your opinion goes against previous news.Your analogy makes no sense whatsoever. That actual source only proves that they havent come up with a plot yet.... just like with Rebellion after the tv series ended.It doesnt say anything about no plans at all.Actually it is almost the same as what was posted here, only the part about Gen's involvement is totally missing. Basically "We have plans but no storyboard" |
| I cant forgive her for what she did to Madoka in the end, she went total yandere mode, good lord the only yandere I enjoy is Yuno and thats it! |
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Rayla said: So you can't forgive her for saving Madoka from QB and also giving her a normal existence...Meanwhile you like an obsessed freak that would even be willing to kill her lover's mother, tie him with chains for no reason and try to kill all of his friends for that same reason.....makes sense.I cant forgive her for what she did to Madoka in the end, she went total yandere mode, good lord the only yandere I enjoy is Yuno and thats it! |
Rayla said: Yuno is about the worst character I've ever come across.I cant forgive her for what she did to Madoka in the end, she went total yandere mode, good lord the only yandere I enjoy is Yuno and thats it! Things to remember: 1. You do NOT compare Homura to Yuno. 2. You do NOT compare Homura to Yuno. 3. You do NOT mention Mirai Nikki (or anything in it) in a Madoka thread. Also what ssjokg said. Thank you. |
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Botato said: Rayla said: Yuno is about the worst character I've ever come across.I cant forgive her for what she did to Madoka in the end, she went total yandere mode, good lord the only yandere I enjoy is Yuno and thats it! Things to remember: 1. You do NOT compare Homura to Yuno. 2. You do NOT compare Homura to Yuno. 3. You do NOT mention Mirai Nikki (or anything in it) in a Madoka thread. Also what ssjokg said. Thank you. True But it could have been worse. A guy fews months ago said, that Yuno is a much more relatable and likeable character than any of the girls in Madoka. Another one complained about that "Unlike MN, Madoka is not dark". Sure.... |
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| I think everyone should avoid the first guy. |
HeisenDurden said: I'm guessing you missed the (very serious question) "how can someone compare Madoka Magica to Mirai Nikki?"True But it could have been worse. A guy fews months ago said, that Yuno is a much more relatable and likeable character than any of the girls in Madoka. Another one complained about that "Unlike MN, Madoka is not dark". Sure.... God that was awful. |
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ssjokg said: Rayla said: So you can't forgive her for saving Madoka from QB and also giving her a normal existence...Meanwhile you like an obsessed freak that would even be willing to kill her lover's mother, tie him with chains for no reason and try to kill all of his friends for that same reason.....makes sense.I cant forgive her for what she did to Madoka in the end, she went total yandere mode, good lord the only yandere I enjoy is Yuno and thats it! Woah dude, chill your raging. It's just their personal preference... And to be fair, when Homura was first introduced no one had any idea she'd lose it like she did and become so completely obsessed over Madoka that it sort of became a little stranger than it already was. So people liked her the way she was, and when she changed the way she did she wasn't the same girl they admired anymore. Meanwhile with Yuno, we all knew what we were getting in for. And we got exactly that. No promises were broken, so people could come to love her for exactly the way she is. |
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InTheOtherWorld said: But "I can't forgive her" implies what she did was horrible.Woah dude, chill your raging. It's just their personal preference... And to be fair, when Homura was first introduced no one had any idea she'd lose it like she did and become so completely obsessed over Madoka that it sort of became a little stranger than it already was. So people liked her the way she was, and when she changed the way she did she wasn't the same girl they admired anymore. Meanwhile with Yuno, we all knew what we were getting in for. And we got exactly that. No promises were broken, so people could come to love her for exactly the way she is. It wasn't. And also nothing was broken, Homura is still the same girl obsessed with saving and protecting Madoka that she was in the series. |
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Botato said: InTheOtherWorld said: But "I can't forgive her" implies what she did was horrible.Woah dude, chill your raging. It's just their personal preference... And to be fair, when Homura was first introduced no one had any idea she'd lose it like she did and become so completely obsessed over Madoka that it sort of became a little stranger than it already was. So people liked her the way she was, and when she changed the way she did she wasn't the same girl they admired anymore. Meanwhile with Yuno, we all knew what we were getting in for. And we got exactly that. No promises were broken, so people could come to love her for exactly the way she is. It wasn't. And also nothing was broken, Homura is still the same girl obsessed with saving and protecting Madoka that she was in the series. Horrible or not, Madoka made her wish of her own personal choice. It was what she wanted and if Homura truly cared for her then she would have let Madoka to continue to be with the Law of Cycles. Even if the Incubators had a plan to capture Madoka and eventually break the Law of a Cycles to enable witches in the world once more, Madoka's wish should've still cancelled it out. Homura should not have forced her own desires onto Madoka, especially when Madoka herself was clearly against it. Madoka told her to stop before she was separated, and she was uncomfortable in Homura's new world. She was trying to break free. Except she isn't. Granted, her goals and outcomes are the same, but that wasn't what I was talking about. When you love a character, it's normally for their personality and not their goals (at least in my case). In the original series Homura was an underdog figure and people loved her for her no-nonsense attitude and cool demeanour. In Rebellion this Homucifer figure is now much more psychotic and unstable. If it wasn't for the fact that they looked the same, had I known any better I would've called them different characters. In terms of personality, Homura is not the same girl that was so popular from the original series. People expect that Homura, not this one. |
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InTheOtherWorld said: Uhmm.. Their plan wasn't to "enable witches" it was to capture Madoka and control her. If she is captured how exactly will she be able to continue being the law of cycles?Horrible or not, Madoka made her wish of her own personal choice. It was what she wanted and if Homura truly cared for her then she would have let Madoka to continue to be with the Law of Cycles. Even if the Incubators had a plan to capture Madoka and eventually break the Law of a Cycles to enable witches in the world once more, Madoka's wish should've still cancelled it out. What Homura did is actually she saved Madoka. InTheOtherWorld said: But so did Madoka. Homura's desire is to protect Madoka, yet she denied her of her wish. And likewise, Homura begged Madoka to stop in the ending of the TV series too and not erase her existence as a human.Homura should not have forced her own desires onto Madoka, especially when Madoka herself was clearly against it. Madoka told her to stop before she was separated, and she was uncomfortable in Homura's new world. She was trying to break free. InTheOtherWorld said: But given what happened and the situation she was in, it makes perfect sense and it's a logical development. I don't understand why people complain.Except she isn't. Granted, her goals and outcomes are the same, but that wasn't what I was talking about. When you love a character, it's normally for their personality and not their goals (at least in my case). In the original series Homura was an underdog figure and people loved her for her no-nonsense attitude and cool demeanour. In Rebellion this Homucifer figure is now much more psychotic and unstable. If it wasn't for the fact that they looked the same, had I known any better I would've called them different characters. In terms of personality, Homura is not the same girl that was so popular from the original series. People expect that Homura, not this one. |
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Botato said: InTheOtherWorld said: Uhmm.. Their plan wasn't to "enable witches" it was to capture Madoka and control her. If she is captured how exactly will she be able to continue being the law of cycles?Horrible or not, Madoka made her wish of her own personal choice. It was what she wanted and if Homura truly cared for her then she would have let Madoka to continue to be with the Law of Cycles. Even if the Incubators had a plan to capture Madoka and eventually break the Law of a Cycles to enable witches in the world once more, Madoka's wish should've still cancelled it out. What Homura did is actually she saved Madoka. InTheOtherWorld said: But so did Madoka. Homura's desire is to protect Madoka, yet she denied her of her wish. And likewise, Homura begged Madoka to stop in the ending of the TV series too and not erase her existence as a human.Homura should not have forced her own desires onto Madoka, especially when Madoka herself was clearly against it. Madoka told her to stop before she was separated, and she was uncomfortable in Homura's new world. She was trying to break free. InTheOtherWorld said: But given what happened and the situation she was in, it makes perfect sense and it's a logical development. I don't understand why people complain.Except she isn't. Granted, her goals and outcomes are the same, but that wasn't what I was talking about. When you love a character, it's normally for their personality and not their goals (at least in my case). In the original series Homura was an underdog figure and people loved her for her no-nonsense attitude and cool demeanour. In Rebellion this Homucifer figure is now much more psychotic and unstable. If it wasn't for the fact that they looked the same, had I known any better I would've called them different characters. In terms of personality, Homura is not the same girl that was so popular from the original series. People expect that Homura, not this one. Forgive me, my mind isn't exactly clear on the events of the movie as I try my best to erase its existence from my memory. Saved her or not, Madoka didn't want it. And Madoka must have known this was going to happen, as at the end of the original series she told Homura that she knew everything that was, will and could have been. So she must've foreseen that the Incubators would have attempted this, yet she was still trying to get Homura to stop. But then this goes back to what Homura said during her transition to a new being, Madoka's act was of selfless love, and Homura's was selfish. Madoka did this with good intentions and all magical girls' best interests at heart, to stop their suffering as witches. Homura is included in this, as if Madoka had not done this then she would have forever been stuck in her time loop until she eventually gave in and became a witch. And Mitakihara and Madoka's family would've still been in danger from Walpurgis, which was the last thing she wanted because she cared about her friends and family more than anything, even herself. After this Homura would be free to move on and make new friends; she would even have been reunited with Madoka one day herself. But oh no, Homura didn't do this. She took Madoka's powers by force. And unlike Madoka's new world, practically no one gets anything out of this. Even though she now has Madoka under protection, Madoka is unhappy and is trying to break free. Homura herself stated that one day they will become enemies. Homura may be happy, but she is on the verge of a mental break down. Her world is filled with familiars and is corrupted and dark. The characters within it aren't happy. Mami tried to catch a petal blossom, but instead it became a dark feather. Sayaka is now stuck, powerless, and will each day witness the very situation that turned her into a witch. Kyuubey was not happy with the order of Madoka's world, but now it seems he has gotten a far worse deal than ever before. Homura may have finally had her wish granted, but the outcome is twisted. Madoka did it for everyone. Homura did it for herself. Let's put it this way; if you had a character that you enjoyed and loved, would you like it if they became evil and malicious and completely the opposite of what they originally were? I know I wouldn't. Even if it makes sense and is a logical decision, this character is no longer what you loved so much. It is completely logical for Homura to become insane and unstable, but that doesn't mean people will bow down and love her for it. It doesn't work like that. |
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| What Botato said(I like it when I dont have to type everything). Everyone is bitching about Homura and her actions as if she did something horrible, as if she hurt Madoka's feelings and wishes, but nobody is bitching about Madoka shitting on Homura's wishes.Where is the difference?What makes Madoka's action more right than Homura's? Homura is nowhere near a different char.Because she was(And still is) unstable and because at that time she had power, she made the choice that she couldnt do in the tv series:stop Madoka.It is the exact same character as in the tv series only more determinated and more powerful. @new reply YEah thank you for proving that you didnt get shit from the 3rd movie OR the tv series. 1.Homura didnt want Madoka to sacrifice herself either.It doesnt matter what their reasons were. Madoka was the first to trample over Homura's wishes. Then MAdoka is an idiot if she actually knew this would happen and didnt do anything to protect the Cycle from QB.It doesnt make sense to blame Homuar for protecting Madoka and Madoka's wish. 2.So Homura didnt have good intentions?Even by saving Madoka and only Madoka from QB she saved every other magical girl as well. Except Homura and the others wouldnt be able to make new friends.Their battles didnt disappear nor their fates of dying VERY young.And that is the point, even if she was reunited with Madoka,QB would fuck things up later and everything prior to that would be meaningless. 3.She didnt take Madoka's powers.It was her own powers.She only separated Madoka from the Cycle.The Cycle still exists.Nobody is getting anything from this? Sayaka and Nagisa got a second chance in life.Mami has a cute kouhai and Sayaka with Kyoko are friends.Madoka reunites with her family.Madoka isnt unhappy she just feels that something is wrong which is totally different. The magical girls no longer have to fight and despair and QB is made to collect all curses.Homura ISNT happy.Her words, actions and familiars show that.She finally "has" Madoka but stays away from her because she knows she will cause her to change again. So Mami catching a black feather and Sayaka being powerless(like everyone else for the moment) is proof that they are unhappy?Ok makes sense .....too bad that every other scene shows the exact opposite. Homura did it for herself but still got BETTER results than Madoka. For a "dark and corrupted" world, it sure is a lot happier than the previous two. 4. InTheOtherWorld said: ssjokg said: So you can't forgive her for saving Madoka from QB and also giving her a normal existence...Meanwhile you like an obsessed freak that would even be willing to kill her lover's mother, tie him with chains for no reason and try to kill all of his friends for that same reason.....makes sense. Woah dude, chill your raging. It's just their personal preference... And to be fair, when Homura was first introduced no one had any idea she'd lose it like she did and become so completely obsessed over Madoka that it sort of became a little stranger than it already was. So people liked her the way she was, and when she changed the way she did she wasn't the same girl they admired anymore. Meanwhile with Yuno, we all knew what we were getting in for. And we got exactly that. No promises were broken, so people could come to love her for exactly the way she is. Even if it is their personal preference it is still nonsensical. Those that had their promises broken didnt get Homura's char at all.They are the same people that saw her as satisfied with Madoka's wish.It doesnt make sense.In all 12 eps of the tv series and the 3 movies Homura is the obsessed girl that tries her best,use anything she can, to save her best friend from a fucked up fate. How exactly were those "promises" broken?They didnt.The character they, you, whoever thought they understood and liked had nothing to do with the actual character. "Cool" Homura wasnt the "real" Homura. The obsessed one was.Ep 10 cant make it even more obvious than it is. |
ssjokgJun 23, 2014 10:18 AM
ssjokg said: What Botato said(I like it when I dont have to type everything). Everyone is bitching about Homura and her actions as if she did something horrible, as if she hurt Madoka's feelings and wishes, but nobody is bitching about Madoka shitting on Homura's wishes.Where is the difference?What makes Madoka's action more right than Homura's? Homura is nowhere near a different char.Because she was(And still is) unstable and because at that time she had power, she made the choice that she couldnt do in the tv series:stop Madoka.It is the exact same character as in the tv series only more determinated and more powerful. InTheOtherWorld said: Woah dude, chill your raging. It's just their personal preference... And to be fair, when Homura was first introduced no one had any idea she'd lose it like she did and become so completely obsessed over Madoka that it sort of became a little stranger than it already was. So people liked her the way she was, and when she changed the way she did she wasn't the same girl they admired anymore. Meanwhile with Yuno, we all knew what we were getting in for. And we got exactly that. No promises were broken, so people could come to love her for exactly the way she is. Even if it is their personal preference it is still nonsensical. Those that had their promises broken didnt get Homura's char at all.They are the same people that saw her as satisfied with Madoka's wish.It doesnt make sense.In all 12 eps of the tv series and the 3 movies Homura is the obsessed girl that tries her best,use anything she can, to save her best friend from a fucked up fate. How exactly were those "promises" broken?They didnt.The character they, you, whoever thought they understood and liked had nothing to do with the actual character. "Cool" Homura wasnt the "real" Homura. The obsessed one was.Ep 10 cant make it even more obvious than it is. Because someone has a different opinion from you, that in no way makes it nonsensical. No one's opinion, not even yours, is right. Yet, no one's is wrong either. That is the nature of an opinion. Not everyone analyses Madoka Magica with a deep and analytical mind. Some people just want to enjoy it. What they saw was a cool girl who would do anything to protect her friend. They liked that. What they then got was a dark and psychotic character who wasn't like this cool girl in the slightest. They didn't like that. That's all there is to it. It doesn't matter if this dark character is the reality of the cool girl or not. It's as simple as that. Would you like it if you were promised an action-thriller movie at the cinema, only to find out it was a rom-com? Not many people would, even if it were the true side of the movie. The same goes for this, because ultimately Madoka Magica is just a TV show. Yes, but the weak, scared, broken and crying little girl that they gave us as the reality to Homura in the original series is nowhere even close to the dark, evil, unstable and malicious god figure they presented us with in Rebellion. And you know, some people just liked the cool figure, even if it wasn't the real Homura. And some people won't like the dark figure, even if it is the real Homura. It all comes down to taste. |
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InTheOtherWorld said: But oh no, Homura didn't do this. She took Madoka's powers by force. And unlike Madoka's new world, practically no one gets anything out of this. Even though she now has Madoka under protection, Madoka is unhappy and is trying to break free. Whoa hold it right there. I haven't even finished but I just HAVE to respond. Madoka is definitely happy. What makes her happy is being with her family and friends and having an ordinary life. She said that in the TV series, and said it again in Rebellion. The reason she does what she does is out of duty, not because she's happy to do it. Being the law of the cycle that she is is actually painful to her, and she's suffering. Alright now I'll continue reading. |
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| A serial killer-rapist is better than an obsessed friend. So is that right or wrong? This "opinion cant be wrong or right" is bullshit. That doesnt makes sense at all.So their opinion is right because it is wrong? If they cant be bothered to analyze something or just open their eyes and pay attention then they shouldnt be bothered to have an opinion either.The movie analogy is so off in this argument. And are you implying that because Madoka is a tv show we shouldnt be bothered that much?I hope that I am reading this the wrong way because then what the hell are you doing here? Wait Rebellion's Homura isnt weak, scared or broken? BEcause that is what lead her to do all those "horrible" things. |
ssjokg said: (I like it when I dont have to type everything). Yeah me too. |
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| what Botato and ssjokg said. Madoka Magica is a dark anime, it's not a shounen show. you can't complain if they changed her character into a psycho. What Homura did made me like her even more, even though the twist could've been done better, i like it. and the movie deserves some kind of a sequel, another movie or OVA or series. i remember Urobuchi Gen saying in an interview prior to the movie's release they are planning to continue the franchise. |
"There’s a wall between the normal and the abnormal—that way of thinking was wrong from the beginning. Of course, you have to differentiate between the normal and the abnormal, and you won’t be able to live if you don’t, but this and that are like bordering countries—over here and over there are connected." ~Senjougahara Hitagi~ |
| The Truth: People like Grimdark Satan Allegory Homura more than Normal sense making Homura. Thats why the movie is so successful. Because its not Urobuchi without mind rape, crazy face and suicide. |
CrankyRIP said: Don't start this again man :pwhat Botato and ssjokg said. Madoka Magica is a dark anime, it's not a shounen show. you can't complain if they changed her character into a psycho. What Homura did made me like her even more, even though the twist could've been done better, i like it. and the movie deserves some kind of a sequel, another movie or OVA or series. i remember Urobuchi Gen saying in an interview prior to the movie's release they are planning to continue the franchise. Go back one or two pages and you can see the argument that transpired regarding this :) |
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Botato said: CrankyRIP said: Don't start this again man :pwhat Botato and ssjokg said. Madoka Magica is a dark anime, it's not a shounen show. you can't complain if they changed her character into a psycho. What Homura did made me like her even more, even though the twist could've been done better, i like it. and the movie deserves some kind of a sequel, another movie or OVA or series. i remember Urobuchi Gen saying in an interview prior to the movie's release they are planning to continue the franchise. Go back one or two pages and you can see the argument that transpired regarding this :) I started nothing. i saw the argument of the Mirai Nikki comparison, oh there was something like what i said. well sorry anyway. DON'T START AN ARGUMENT..PLEASE. |
"There’s a wall between the normal and the abnormal—that way of thinking was wrong from the beginning. Of course, you have to differentiate between the normal and the abnormal, and you won’t be able to live if you don’t, but this and that are like bordering countries—over here and over there are connected." ~Senjougahara Hitagi~ |
SolviteSekai said: Yes exactly. It's obvious no need to point it out.The Truth: People like Grimdark Satan Allegory Homura more than Normal sense making Homura. Thats why the movie is so successful. Because its not Urobuchi without mind rape, crazy face and suicide. CrankyRIP said: Okay ._.DON'T START AN ARGUMENT..PLEASE. |
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